Exposing the underbelly of Armstrongism in all of its wacky glory! Nothing you read here is made up. What you read here is the up to date face of Herbert W Armstrong's legacy. It's the gritty and dirty behind the scenes look at Armstrongism as you have never seen it before!
With all the new crazy self-appointed Chief Overseers, Apostles, Prophets, Pharisees, legalists, and outright liars leading various Churches of God today, it is important to hold these agents of deception accountable.
Herbert Armstrong's Tangled Web of Corrupt Leaders
There was no way in hell I was going to sit and listen to Elijah Dave's first superfantabulous sermon. It was 2 hours long and certainly NO COG minister deserves to be listened to for 2 hours straight! If they cant say what they need to say in 20 minutes then they need to shut up. 130 points do not prove anything. Shit still stinks even when 130 points are used to make it smell better.
Thankfully some of you have/are doing it.
Elijah Dave has taken a huge financial hit recently after his failed prophecies Money did not flow in along with new members after the Feast of Tabernacles last year. Now Elijah Dave is back telling his brain-dead members that they are to sell everything they have and send it to him.
Pack explains his interpretation of the phrase ‘all things in common’
(Acts 2:44 & 4:32): sell everything you have and send the money to
him.
“It’s absolutely biblical that what we have, we sell, whatsoever
we have, we give it to God’s work. That’s why we were called. You’re
not allowed to hold on to your own income.”
“You are not allowed to
hold on to your own assets. You have an income, you live a wonderful
life, life goes on normally. But if you were called by God and you are
to participate in His work and walk in His ways, you have to turn over
your assets to God’s church. That’s the pattern.”
“It won’t leave you a pauper, it won’t break your life.”
The self appointed Elijah wanna-be Davey Pack has posted the start of his superfantabulous sermon series that contain ONE HUNDRED THIRTY"proofs" on why he is the most superfantabulous Elijah to walk this earth since the "real" one. Herbert Armstrong be damned, Elijah Dave's the man!
Elijah Dave feels some need to have 130 "proof's" on why he is such a sinless creature. Elijah Dave has elevated himself ABOVE Jesus with these 130 "proof's" of virtue.
Dave starts his latest self-serving slobberfest concerning his speaking abilities and wisdom with this :
After 15 minutes, you will not want to stop. And don’t let your minister stop you. He cannot give you eternal life!
Apparently salvation is NOT possible without Elijah Dave.
With Elijah Dave's immaculate and ungodly appearance upon this earth his god will stop his destruction of the earth now that he Elijah Dave is here. The entire Church of God has apparently been waiting in eager anticipation for Elijah Dave's arrival. Don't worry about the coming of Jesus, Elijah Dave is MORE important.
Among the most important prophecies in Scripture, Malachi 4:5-6
states that without the end-time Elijah’s arrival, God would “smite the
earth with utter destruction”! Thousands with a Church background are
waiting for Elijah (Matt. 17:11), believing this man to be one of the Two Witnesses (Rev. 11:3). Scripture makes clear this theory is ABSOLUTELY IMPOSSIBLE. But, if Herbert W. Armstrong was not the Elijah, who was he? The answer is crucial in ways only the sermon can show you, and must be understood before God reunifies His people.
Next Elijah Dave waxes eloquent on how eloquent and charming he is as a speaker. No other man in human history has ever been as dynamic or wise as Elijah Dave. Jesus' words pale in comparison to God's most important man to ever live in the Church of God.
Elijah Dave's message was sooooooooooooooooooooooo superfantabulous that not one single person in the ENTIRE Restored Church of God disagreed with him! NOT ONE! Well of course not! Given that they would quickly be disfellowshipped and marked for doing so. Families would be broken and marriages destroyed, but Elijah Dave needs to be believed.
These are the most important messages I have ever given. Hundreds in The Restored Church of God have commented in just the last two days
like this: “electrifying,” “exhilarating,” “amazing,” “gripping,”
“game-changing,” “awesome,” “captivating,” “overwhelming,” “tremendously
inspiring,” “profound,” “mind-blowing” and “emphatically irrefutable.”
Great numbers said they understood the message in less than 10 proofs.
Few even needed the LAST 100 PROOFS! And no one—none!—to our knowledge out of thousands who heard has disagreed, and we have heard from virtually every pastorate in the world!
Elijah Dave's message is soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo incredible that it will soon divide every single Church of God right down the middle. Elijah Dave takes great delight in knowing he intends to destroy more families and lives.
To reject Elijah Dave and his message is equivalent to rejecting the entire Bible. The Bible was written to foretell the coming of Elijah Dave and his message of redemption destruction.
These messages will eventually divide the splinters and slivers down the middle. There are two kinds of people. Those driven by emotion—and those led by the Holy Spirit who are driven by scripture, truth, facts, evidence, proof and simple logic.
Perhaps half the people you meet with will agree, and the other half
will attack. THERE IS NO AVOIDING THIS. But, to reject their message,
one must reject a host of IMPOSSIBLE TO MISUNDERSTAND Scriptures!
The disgusting filth that is the Philadelphia Church of God continues its record of abuse towards its members. Elder abuse seems to be an ongoing issue with the PCG, especially when they are set to reap financial gain from bleeding a member dry.
How many more lives and families need to be ripped apart by the revolting polices of this destructive cult?
I have read about the abuse of the elderly in Philadelphia Church of God
and thought it might be time, now that my mom has died, to provide yet
another testimony concerning this issue. This one has an added
difference. She was the widow of a minister in the PCG.
Now for her story. I don't know about the widows of all of the
ministers, but I can testify that this widow received no pension or help
from PCG headquarters. After she had given a great deal of her
inheritance to the PCG, and being only on social security and still
tithing that little sum, she requested third tithe
assistance as her rent had gone up. You know this is the tithe that is
supposed to be used for the widows and fatherless. Well, they took
several months to get back to her. It took so long that she had to renew
her lease and was on the hook for rent for another year. Finally, her
regional pastor, whom I won't name, but his first and last initials are
the same [C. C.], called her and told her that if she had been a better
steward of her money she would not need to "beg from the church." You
read that right--beg. They thanked her for her donations and then accused her of being a poor steward of her money because she needed help.
-----
She was devastated. I suggested she ask for her money back so that
she could show them what a good steward she could be if not being
coerced into giving all her money to them, but she wouldn't do that. She
decided she couldn't live on her own anymore and, like a good PCG
follower, she counseled with her regional minister about moving in with
her son, my brother. He told her she was not been allowed to move in
with him because he was "toxic." This minister didn't know my brother.
He had never been in a "church of God" [WCG offshoot] but he had made it
quite clear to our stepfather minister how he felt about the whole
thing. She decided she was going to move in with him anyway and did. Yay
to my mom! This was the beginning of her thinking on her own.
-------
She was in and out of hospitals and rehab centers for a couple of
months and during that time was anointed at least three times by the
ministers from the church I attend and visited by those she had formerly
shunned who had never gone to the PCG. I might add that she never did
believe the shunning
was right and a lot of the people in the PCG don't believe it either.
They live in fear. These were her own words. She told me she feared the regional minister more than God and came to realize that was not the way to be.1
There is no love in the PCG ministry. She indicated her previous
minister, Aaron Eagle, was a much better person than the minister she
had at the end and she thought that he was put out because of it. She
saw that God is trying to build a family and that Satan, through PCG, is
trying to destroy families.
In the end, Mom had to recant what she said when she told me she
had to shun me for my own good, about being poor, blind and naked when
she realized it is the PCG that fits that description.2
The following question was asked on a Facebook page the other day. It stirred up a stink on a pro-sabbath group and found wisdom on another group that was filled with exCOG members.
With James Malm, Dave Pack and other spitting and snarling about sabbath breaking it is quit obvious which side of the fence they sit on. Grace and wisdom be damned, the law must stand!
Who is the biggest sinner - the man who molests his daughter/the woman who gossips about every person she knows but they cross the t's and dot the i's when it comes to sabbath keeping, or the man/woman who has to work Saturday because their children are starving and wearing rags and they are about to lose the roof over their heads?
Baghdad Dave next takes a jab at ALL the 700 some splinter personalty cults of the Church of God. There is not one single COG out there that has had healing like have happened in Baghdad Dave's church. God has spit the rest of the COG out and only heals in the Restored Church of God.
DRAMATIC HEALINGS AND PROTECTION: As mentioned,
the Church has recently seen some of the most amazing and inspiring
miracles in memory. Since my post-Feast sermon describing how God’s
Church could begin to see more of His power through miracles and
protection, this has been happening—and in a BIG way! Members have been
experiencing an unprecedented instances of DRAMATIC healing and protection! The accounts are now being reported daily, with often several in a single day (three today so far)—and we are smaller than the big splinters.
A 2-part sermon series given January 10 presented 30 PROOFS that mass
healings will soon come to ALL OF GOD’S PEOPLE. The Bible is bedrock
certain on this truth, which is in addition to the two great truths referenced at the outset. It will be posted several days after the sermons posted February 2.
What are some of the miracles Baghdad Dave is proclaiming?
Phantom cars that are able to pass right though people on the freeway:
“We were traveling down I-95 heading toward Melbourne [Florida]. Another member was driving and we were talking when suddenly a car passed right through us! It was going very fast and never slowed down.
I was sitting in the passenger seat and the other car passed right through me and the vehicle I was sitting in! It made a whoosh sound.
Woo Hoo!
God is amazing! His protection over us is profound.
What happened to us is just another proof we are truly in God’s one true
Church.”
Another phantom vehicle:
The officer told her what had happened since he had been behind her. She had swerved into the other lane and passed right through a semi-truck (while unconscious!). She then passed back through the semi-truck to the right side of the road and came to a stop and parked. The trooper said that although he ‘saw everything that had happened, he could not write it up since no one would believe him.’”
Bouncing bullets:
While driving as an escort behind a semi-truck, a member in Colombia
was attacked by two armed men on motorcycles. They tried to kill him
and steal his car. One man shot into the vehicle twice. One bullet left a
hole through the door but incredibly missed everything, and was not
found. The other bullet hit him in the abdomen. Miraculously, a direct
hit bounced off, leaving only a bruise. (Author’s Note: All of
us at Headquarters have seen the pictures of the middle of his merely
bruised abdomen and the mangled bullet that bounced off.)
God protects members car but lets pagan civilian's car get severely damaged:
When we pulled into a parking lot to assess damage—no
one was hurt! The elderly gentleman in the car that rear-ended the two
members was bruised on his hand when his airbag deployed. The rest of
the group just felt somewhat jarred. The front of his car was crumpled
and the radiator was pouring out fluid. The car carrying the first two
members barely showed damage to the rear, just scuff marks and two cuts
in the bumper. The non-member’s car was severely damaged. The hood of my
car was crumpled a little and the grill and bumper sustained damage but
I was able to drive home three and a half hours at 70 mph.
Canes are being thrown away!
In the Dayton, Ohio, congregation, a
member came to services leaning heavily on a cane. She was in constant
pain and barely able to sleep. After being anointed, she stood up and
began walking slowly. Soon she put down her cane. The pain was gone!
Baghdad Dave even has multiplying steaks! Get the bar-b-que ready!
The next story involves a married couple who host Sabbath services in Chattanooga, Tennessee.
The service involved a Bible Study with a meal in between messages. The
couple had prepared a crockpot of steaks in gravy with other dishes.
They had purchased an exact number of steaks for the members in
attendance. Just before services, a couple from the Knoxville
congregation arrived unexpectedly. Since there would not be enough
steaks for the two extra members, the host couple decided they would not
eat theirs to allow enough for everyone present. The pastor closed the
service with prayer and asked God to bless the food to the nourishment
of all. The couple waited until everyone had gone through the
food line. When they went through the line, they noticed the crockpot
still had steaks in it. They each took one. As they sat down to join the
others, they were shocked to see that everyone had a steak. Bewildered,
they kept it to themselves. Later, the couple was cleaning up and
noticed there were yet more steaks remaining! God had miraculously
multiplied the food. We call it “the miracle of steaks and loaves”!
Next Baghdad Dave claims that the is NO COG in existence today that is having the number of miracles that his group is having. Not a single one! Pack your bags Martha! We are heading to Wadsworth!
The above stories are only the beginning of what
we are hearing by the dozens. Sadly, they stand in stark contrast to
what is NOT happening elsewhere. Yet they could happen—and eventually
will—to thousands who respond to what God plans to do.
Baghdad Dave then says that people will ridicule his claims. Now WHO would EVER dream of such a thing! Ghastly days! What is this church coming to??????
Of course, enemies will seek to play down or dismiss what you have
just read (a few already have)—as well as the sermons to be posted
February 2. But then they have to—or you might leave them and join
us—and that cannot be permitted. Their tactics will work at first, but
these efforts to thwart God’s Work will stand only a little while
longer.
Baghdad Dave then pulls a Herbert W trick. Only YOU can work out your own salvation and PROVE to yourself that what Dave says is true. Even though Baghdad Dave wants it made very clear to you that HIS church is the ONLY one his god is working with in the entire world today.
This letter has brought much proof that God is only working in one organization.
But the burden of proof that we are the only true Church and sole Body
of Christ rests with neither The Restored Church of God nor me. It is
not our responsibility to prove to you God’s government is here—or that
the only Work He directs is here. This is your responsibility! God commands His people, “Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling” (Phil. 2:12).
All of the other Church of God's are nothing but "DEPLORABLE!
Jesus taught, “You shall know them by their fruits” (Matt. 7:16), and shortly followed this with, “Wherefore by their fruits you shall know them” (vs. 20).
The fruits of the splinters are deplorable. These organizations are
wrought with ever-worsening division, confusion and disagreement—and
widespread and worsening doctrinal compromise—truly the blind following
the blind. On the basis of fruits alone, all should leave these organizations! Determine to be without excuse in identifying God’s Church, Truth and Work.
For more miraculous healings and occurrences look here.
Dave Pack is going into orgasmic ecstasy today proclaiming his itty-bitty personalty cult based in Wadsworth is the most superfantabulous Church of God EVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVER! You may need a cold shower after reading Baghdad Dave's hyperbole.
While many or most of our statistics have exploded yet again, most of this letter focuses on the marvelous miracles
being experienced by God’s people here. Very dramatic accounts of
healings and divine protection are increasing almost exponentially in
The Restored Church of God. There are reasons. In fact, I explained a
little over three months ago (just after the Feast, where about eight to
ten had occurred) that this could begin to increase. AND IT HAS! In
almost 50 years in God’s Way, I have never seen—or even heard
of!—anything like it in God’s Church. Of course we are greatly
inspired, but at the same time not really surprised. Also, this
wonderful trend relates to powerful things you will soon learn about THIS Church!
Brethren, we have been seeing certain miracles and
healings all along, and they were irrefutable, but there has been an
ENORMOUS surge—perhaps eight to ten each week now!!!
Baghdad Dave gushes about his superfantabulous ministry as the biggest in the entire world!
Never before has Christ’s Church been so poised to launch forward. In EVERY category, we have become solid and prepared
for MUCH greater things. Unprecedented tools are being used to reach
people in all nations with God’s truth. And God is powerfully blessing
His Work! We have produced the largest amount of literature—books,
booklets, articles, magazines, Bible lessons, form letters, brochures,
etc.—in the history of the Church of God. Apart from the ongoing need to
produce our three regular magazines, all of the literature of
the Church when it was “on track” under Mr. Armstrong’s leadership is
now complete—plus much, much more. This has meant that The Restored
Church of God has developed into the largest biblically based publishing
operation on Earth today—and in history! This is why our websites are
the most comprehensive of any kind of religious website!
Imagine that! A Church of God has a web site that is the largest in the entire world. No other church has as much information online or does as much work as Davey and crew!. Awesome dude!
Did you know that the ONLY hope for humankind is to be found in Wadsworth, Ohio?
But a deceived mankind does not realize that the only true hope for its future is divine intervention. This marvelous hope is going out undiluted from only one place—The Restored Church of God.
Dave sends out another Clarion call for more money to pour in. His exploding student body in Wadsworth needs a new Student Center patterned after Pasadena's.
AMBASSADOR CENTER: What we call “AC” currently
enrolls 91 students, with hundreds of alumni across the globe. The
college moved into new classrooms last year, which make use of
cutting-edge technology to produce and film live classes. These are also
used to hold Ambassador Center events such as its recent sixth
anniversary. Several new courses were added this year, along with others
being updated. The truly magnificent fifth Envoy (paralleling
the WCG’s) is in production and a record-breaking number of copies were
ordered in 2014! The Work continues to employ students and alumni in
full- and part-time positions. Growth in faculty, student body and
curriculum will soon bring the need for a dedicated Ambassador Student Center building.
Then to stick the knife into Rod Meredith and Gerald Flurry's back Baghdad Davey says that the two of them combined cannot even equal Davey's magnificence.
None—and I mean NONE!!!—of the totals and numbers you are reading are seen in any of the splinter groups, which have been trying to draw away God’s people for over 20 years. Maybe no two groups together rival any of these numbers. God is blessing us VERY POWERFULLY!
You can read lots of statistics from Baghdad Davey here.
Forget everything you ever heard from HWA and crew about Satan being the ruler of this world. Gerald Waterhouse would be appalled to hear what Eric King is now promoting as "truth."
The god of this world is Set-on.
When we talk
about the “Keepers” we are talking about what most would call “the angels of
God”. These would be the GOOD angels; they did not side with Set-on, the
“Wicked One”. We have talked about the fact that there were created beings that
were the custodians of our galaxy and of our planet. These are anciently called
the “angels of heaven”. They are now broken apart into two classes due to the
KT war which broke out some 65 million years ago.-
The “bad”
angels which sided with Set-on are still “overseers” of our “fallen” planet and
still participate in its evolution.
Don't worry too much about Set-on, the Keepers are here to make our evolutionary journey more enjoyable:
The
Keepers are a large group of created entities (unfathomable) which supervise
the destiny of our planet.
Now if you would only pay attention to the delusional mind of Eric King, you would have a mind upgrade by now.
Right now
those who are true Christians have received a mind upgrade through the power of
Divine Mind Linkage. Anciently it was
talked about as “receiving the Holy Spirit”. The Apostle Paul invoked the
phrase “new creatures in Christ” and
he talked about each of us having “the
mind of Christ in you”. This was advanced verbage for his time. Now science
is validating these and other phrases used by Jesus Christ and the apostles.-
When a human
receives the Space Age Christian “upgrade” he or she becomes what we call a midway being.
This simply means that the human is now considered a stage one hybrid. Stage-oners have been impregnated
with Holy Spirit. When the person receives his/her complete new body they will
then become a full Elah [Evolutionary
Level Above Human].
So what is the "Keepers" job?
So why did we
decide on calling the good angels “the Keepers”? It is because they are the
preservers of life and the will of Divine Intelligence that we call them the
Keepers. They truly are our friends. They send signals to leaders on our planet
all the time. Sometimes they send warnings and use weather conditions to give
us wake up calls. Because the weather on our planet is going into chaos due to
human pollutions and some natural causes we are being challenged to become
concerned. The Keepers want us to pay
attention.-
These
seraphic custodians (the Keepers) are higher beings of knowledge and truth. We
sometimes refer to both classes of angels as I.B.’s (Intelligent Beings). We
must not confuse the angels with the lower species of extraterrestrials which
exist in our universe.-
The higher
classes, the angels, have much more power and control than any other
extraterrestrial class. They have greater abilities. When we talk about
cherubs/angels using bodies we mean that all cherubs/angels already have higher
energy bodies but when functioning in our dense reality of physicality they
interface with a biological entity of their choice. In other words they connect
to the brains of physical beings in our dimension. This sounds amazing because
it is.
When "Set-on" and the Adramelech's went to heaven to fight with God they were cast back to the earth. Some of them landed in Arizona where they left a hole in the ground...and when those big bad meanies hit the earth it wiped out the dinosaurs.
If we want to
know when the angelic rebellion occurred all we have to do is find the time of
the dinosaurs destruction. We now know that this angelic “super war” broke out around 65 million years ago. When war broke
out in heaven Lucifer [Set-on] and his angelic horde left their physical bodies
and tried to war with God [the Keepers] in heaven. They were eventually cast
back down to our planet and they left four
giant craters when cast down. One of the last of these craters can be found
in the state of Arizona.-
When they
were cast down much of our planet was destroyed including the dinosaurs. The
earth became covered with dark clouds and many things died. Modern scientists
refer to this time as “the KT event”.
So what did these pissed off Adramelech's do once they landed in Arizona? They became stuck in the apes God was playing with as he was trying to create man. That must really have sucked Adramelech's and humiliated God because he failed to stop the Adramelechs from possessing the ape-men.
So now the
angelic host that had fallen lost their capability to take back their regular
glorified physical bodies so instead God [through Logos] began to create a host
of animal like creatures that they became stuck in. Simply put, these angels
were placed in physical bodies which resembled ape like creatures. They could
stay invisible and get by but they missed their first glorified bodies so they
tried out all sorts of animal like creatures. This was the beginning of their
punishment.
God's most important man on earth, after Davey Pack, is back tossing deflated footballs at COG members who will be gathering to watch the Super Bowl. It's a pagan filthy celebration that REAL Christians would dream of watching.
This coming Sunday is known as “Super Bowl Sunday” in the USA. Most years, the American football (which is not the same as the sport called soccer in the USA) contest known as the Superbowl is the most watched television program in the USA. Between 100,000,000-200,000,000 are expected to intentionally (as opposed to perhaps seeing a news item about it) watch at least some of it today according to various reports.
Self appointed false prophet Bob Thiel is back spitting spittle about the dangers of football and how it causes people to not "love their neighbor."
9…You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 10 Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law. (Romans 13:9-10, NKJV)
The Super Bowl will do harm to participants in it.
The New Testament also warns Christians against being violent or approving of those that are (Romans 1:28-32), while history records that early Christians would not watch violent sports. Notice one such report from Theophilus of Antioch perhaps written about 180 A.D.:
Consider, therefore, whether those who teach such things can possibly live indifferently, and be commingled in unlawful intercourse, or, most impious of all, eat human flesh, especially when we are forbidden so much as to witness shows of gladiators, lest we become partakers and abettors of murders. But neither may we see the other spectacles, lest our eyes and ears be defiled, participating in the utterances there sung. (Theophilus of Antioch. To Autolycus, Book III, Chapter XV. Translated by Marcus Dods, A.M. Excerpted from Ante-Nicene Fathers, Volume 2. Edited by Alexander Roberts & James Donaldson. American Edition, 1885. Online Edition)
So, Christians did not believe that they were to watch the violent sports so popular in the second century.
Get on your knees and repent from watching this blasphemy! But if you sneak a peak remember that Passover is approaching and you will be forgiven. So enjoy!
What would this world and the Church of God be like if the most important man in human history did not exist? Jesus be damned! Dave's the man!
The Chief Narcissist of the Churches of God has been in hiding since the epic failure of his prophecy that three COG leaders would be killed by his god and that all of their members would jump ship to his cult based in Wadsworth. Two years in a row this prophecy has FAILED. None of his antagonists died and NONE of their members jumped shipped with their money to join Dave's magical mystery tour.
Stung by that failed prophecy, declining membership and dramatic drop in income, Davey had do delay his mini-me auditorium and his student center. Davey is now ready to let the world know that the largest and most superfantabulous COG to exist in history is exploding at the seams with new members joining up and bringing in hundreds of millions of dollars with them.
We will be blessed on Friday with his amazing earth shattering announcement.
The annual “Fruits” letter from Pastor General David C. Pack will be made available next week. As in previous years, it is bursting with statistics of The Restored Church of God’s tremendous growth across many categories, as well as staggering eyewitness accounts of God’s blessings and interventions on behalf of His people—way beyond anything we have ever posted. Be sure to check this page.
The perverse "logic" of James Malm continues unabated. Did you know that it is an abomination to put a premature baby on life support if the mother was not able to complete the pregnancy?
The idea that anyone follows this asshat is amazing! Why are so many Armstrongite cultists attracted to these theologically bankrupt blasphemous idiots?
“If Jesus was produced by the Father’s sperm combining with Mary’s egg we have several issues
A. As it is written in spirit there is no man or woman. Spirits have no sex and cannot reproduce sexually.
B. You have the Father committing adultery with Mary, Since she was not the Father’s wife and was the espoused wife of another.
C You are calling Christ a bastard since he would have been conceived by adultery…….
The truth is that man was made after the God kind, and the very Creator gave up his God-hood to be made flesh and was inserted into the womb of Mary as an already complete human embryo by God the Father; in the same sense that a human embryo can be inserted into a surrogate mother today.”
I find your logic for the above two scenarios a little difficult to follow.
If we look at this in terms of a physical marriage, you seem to be saying that with a married couple who are unable to have children, it would be permissible for the wife to be implanted with an embryo from a completely different couple, and produce a baby that was not related in any way to the woman or her husband.
However you also seem to be saying that if the embryo was from the woman’s own egg, and a donor sperm (as would be the case with an infertile husband), then that would be adultery, and the child would be a bastard.
So carrying and giving birth to a genetically unrelated child is OK, but doing the same for a child which has genetic input from one of the partners is not OK?
CORRECT! In your first case the woman is only a provider of care; in your second case she is an adulteress: but you are switching the issue from the Father to the woman. If a man produces a child by another man’s wife; he IS an adulterer!
That is basic; no man may have another man’s wife; and if a man father’s a child by another man’s wife the child is a bastard and the man is an adulterer. To say that God the Father placed his sperm [which he does not have being a spirit] in Mary, an already promised woman; is accusing the Father of either adultery or fornication. It is calling the Son a bastard. Such claims are blasphemy.
For a woman with an infertile husband to give herself or her eggs to another male in an effort to make a child is adultery; the child is born a bastard; it is an abomination!
Really this is so basic. if you were infertile would you want another man servicing your wife? and even if you did want that; either by intercourse or by mixing in a test tube; it would still be adultery!
On the other hand it is wrong to take a child conceived by you and your own wife, and put it on life support for a few months if your wife could not complete the term of pregnancy.
Also the fact that in vitro results in the destruction of multiple fertilized eggs is also an abomination! I know that several women in UCG have engaged in this appalling abomination with the advice of false elders. James
James responds to this post:
Sir I am informed that you have copied a para answering a comment; before it was edited.
The correct comment response was:
"On the other hand is it wrong to take a child conceived by you and your own wife, and put it on life support for a few months if your wife could not complete the term of pregnancy? Of course not."
A Comment from the previous posting about the Meredith family empire.
Not long ago, I was shown a letter written by an LCG member to a minister in another ACOG. Here is the letter, with some personal information removed:
Dear [minister’s name]:
[Family member and] I are at our wit’s end and don’t know what to do. [Family member] was baptized in [YEAR], and for a while we were both very excited to hear Dr. Meredith and the other ministers preaching from the Bible, teaching so many wonderful things.
When [my family member] moved to Charlotte, I was so happy for [my family member]. Unfortunately, what we have learned since then has torn us up inside.
The shocking truth is that Dr. Meredith is a constant liar who runs LCG for the benefit of his children and their friends. His children have broken civil laws and moral laws that would get any other member kicked out, but family members keep collecting their paychecks. The sheer amount of sin among Dr. Meredith’s own family members is hard to believe unless you see it for yourself. What is even harder to believe is that not only does he tolerate it, he rewards it with office jobs and big salaries. I know this is so hard for loyal LCG members to believe, but [family member] has seen it and could testify in court if required to. It isn’t false rumor.
Even aside from his own family members, Dr. Meredith puts other liars and abusive ministers in positions of authority, and when innocent people ask him about this he attacks or even disfellowships them. Because of this, LCG’s income is down, and Dr. Meredith may soon bankrupt LCG, just as he bankrupted GCG, though the liars around Dr. Meredith are taking big steps to hide this from members.
Behind their backs, Dr. Meredith says awful things about some of his top ministers. Ambitious younger ministers trash-talk Dr. Meredith and are eagerly waiting for him (and other older ministers) to die, so they can move up in the organization. There is no love or loyalty among the ministers in Charlotte, only competition.
Other LCG members have told us these kinds of problems are found in every Church of God headquarters office, and that it was even worse under Mr. Herbert Armstrong, so we should be glad it isn’t even worse than it is at LCG.
My question to you is simple. If [family member] moves to [Home Office city], will [family member] find more of the same, and become even more discouraged? I am concerned that if [family member] moves and only finds more of the same, the discouragement will be too much for either of us to bare.
Please, no more lies. Is [group name] a place where the leadership sincerely tries to live by the bible, and where people do not get ahead through lies and cruel acts? Or must we wait until Christ’s return to find peace and truth and decency in the ministers we rely on?
From a reader here with links to the Living Church of God:
In a recent article put out by LCG Rod
Meredith appoints Dick Ames to be the successor to his
throne. Even if Ames is the "face" they push as the new church
leader, on paper and in truth it will be Jim Meredith. The Meredith's
look at LCG as a 10 Million dollar a year "family business". They
have said as much openly in the presence of many over they years. Of course I
realize that Ames is Meredith's brother in-law (the nepotism in that
organization is profound) but the money and power will be left to the son, Jim.
Unfortunately Jim has a proficiency for bankrupting business. That's how he
ended up suckling off of his daddy's tit in the 1st place. His poor management
and extravagant expenditures caused his California business to go belly-up so
he was forced to come to Charlotte because he was broke. His daddy tried to
make the move as comfortable as possible for him by putting him in charge of
the Feast of Tabernacles so that he could travel the world, stay in fancy
hotels and eat gourmet meals with the company credit card (I wonder how the
tithing member who makes $300 a week feels about Jim spending $300 a night to
stay at 4 and 5 star hotels with their tithe money). Jim dislikes Charlotte so
much (cool people live in California after all) that he uses any excuse
possible to leave town. His daddy also gave him a cushy executive office right
next to his. Exactly where one would assume the 2nd in command would sit.
At least LCG is wise enough to know that (most) of the members would be
outraged if they thought Jim was taking over so they peddle the rouse that Ames
will be in control (although, so many of the members now blindly follow
anything Rod Meredith he says regardless of its insanity).
When Rod Meredith dies and LCG implodes Jim will take the money and run
(probably to Hawaii) where he will retire comfortably with his wife). I
would venture to guess that legal paperwork is already in place to turn the
bank accounts over to Jim as soon as the old man dies. Ironically, Jim is
spending so much money on travel expenses and Feast sites that there may not be
that much left in the end!
