Sunday, December 23, 2012

Bob Thiel: Being Doubly Blessed With The Holy Spirit Causes Departure From LCG?



Things are getting curiouser and curiouser in Thiel land.  Did Bob finally cross the line this past month with his "prophetic" postings?  Thiel feels he has more wisdom and knowledge about prophecy and end times rigmarole than even Rod Meredith does.  Thiel's anti-Catholic stance and his criticism of President Obama pushed Living Church of God to reign him recently.  Apparently that was only temporary.  It looks like Thiel has parted ways from Living Church of God.

I have had several people email me tonight that Thiel is out of LCG.  I also realize how intensely disliked Thiel is by many in LCG. Looking on his blog tonight there are a couple of strange postings that lightly touch on the subject.

12/16/12 a.m. Basically closed out the News of the Living Church of God page and, while there may be exceptions, expect to post certain types of news related to LCG at this page.
Thiel's LCG page where he wrote about the glories of the one and only TRUE church (Living) have this comment now:

This may be my last post on this page (though that could change). Future posts, however, are expected be found at the News of Those Once Affiliated with Global page.

He also has this little item that explains his sudden surge in book publishing and his constant radio appearance regarding Mayan prophecy.  Thiel feels he has been doubly blessed with the Holy Spirit.  Apparently way more than his old boss has been blessed.  That certainly has created a sticky situation!

On 12/15/11, a minister in good-standing with LCG anointed Bob Thiel with oil and prayed that God would grant him a double-portion of His Spirit: and things have not been the same since (he still, of course, supports the goals and biblical beliefs of Philadelphia era of the Church of God)

Notice that Thiel now supports the goals and beliefs of the broader Philadelphia area of the church and NOT Living Church of God who he had been proclaiming as God's ONLY church on the entire earth carrying out the proclamation of the gospel.




42 comments:

Anonymous said...

Good for him if he has chosen to part ways with LCG!! He's not the first and he won't be the last to have done so looking at the broader history of the ACOGs. I wonder if he'll write a book based on his own experiences within this cult?

DennisCDiehl said...

Bob is an interesting case and while I don't agree with his views and all things God, I understand the position he finds himself in.

Organizations, especially Churches with a heirarchy as all COGs have simply don't know what to do with those who think for themselves and make their own decisions about beliefs yet want to stay within the organization. They are too much a threat to those who portray themselves as knowing more, which of course they don't.

Bob is an intelligent man. He obviously has a fascination with theology and religion, something which can go ten thousand different ways and does so his views are just that while others have other views of the same material and history as they understand it.

Bob takes things literally true and historically accurate. I would never question his sincerity anymore than I would all those who write on this blog.

A problem with Living Church and others is that those above don't know what to do with the critical thinkers, intelligent, sincere and hard to box up types in their own organizations. Thus we have disfellowshipping, marking and booting. It's the Bible way.

It would never cross the Apostle Paul's mind, in the story, that maybe HE was the problem. When all of Asia forsook him, as he said, he prayed God would not hold it against them. He NEVER wondered why they forsook him. It would not cross his mind he was wrong about some things and his unwillingness to admit it got him booted.

Over all Dr. Thiel is far more intelligent, theologically aware and well read than most of the leadership put together. He's obviously fascinated with theology and end time promises taking them literally and yet future. (Whole other disappointing topic)

I'd probably love having lunch with Dr. Thiel. Heck, Biker Bob and I would have a ball! RCM not so much lol.

DennisCDiehl said...

PS Must be the end of the year, be a little kinder, end of Mayan Calendar (whew)spirit, but I admire his moving on and understand the position knowing what one feels they know puts you in with others who have the appearance of control. Well sometimes it is more than an appearance.

If you read this blog Dr. T, aside from differences, we're all hear to learn and as Bill Hicks notes,

"The world is like a ride at an amusement park, and when you choose to go on it, you think it's real, because that's how powerful our minds are. And the ride goes up and down and round and round and it has thrills and chills and it's very brightly colored and it's very loud. And it's fun, for a while.

Some people have been on the ride for a long time, and they begin to question: 'Is this real? Or is this just a ride?' And other people have remembered, and they come back to us and they say 'Hey! Don't worry, don't be afraid -- ever -- because... this is just a ride.' And we kill those people.

'Shut him up! We have a lot invested in this ride! Shut him up! Look at my furrows of worry; look at my big bank account, and my family. This has to be real.' It's just a ride. But we always kill those good guys who try and tell us that -- ever notice that? -- and we let the demons run amok. But it doesn't matter, because... it's just a ride, and we can change it any time we want. It's only a choice. No effort. No worry. No job. No savings and money. Just a choice, right now, between fear and love. The eyes of fear want you to put bigger locks on your door, buy bigger guns, close yourself off. The eyes of love, instead, see all of us as one.

Here's what we can do to change the world, right now, into a better ride. Take all that money we spend on weapons and defense each year and, instead, spend it feeding, clothing and educating the poor of the world, which it would do many times over -- not one human being excluded -- and we can explore space together, both inner and outer, forever. In peace.

Anonymous said...

I doubt very much if Thiel has left Armstrongism. He may have left LCG, but not the beliefs. Look for him to join up with another or start his own ministry.

Anonymous said...

Comment was made saying: "...On 12/15/11, a minister in good-standing with LCG anointed Bob Thiel with oil and prayed that God would grant him a double-portion of His Spirit: and things have not been the same since (he still, of course, supports the goals and biblical beliefs of Philadelphia era of the Church of God)..."

Who wrote that comment? Was it Bob Thiel writing in the third person?

Either way, doesn't the Bible say that God is no respecter of persons? If that is true, then why would God give a double portion of His Spirit to a Bob Thiel and leave all of the rest of his spiritual brothers (fellow competitors?) and sisters (fellow competitors?) with only a single portion?

That doesn't even make any sense regarding God's Church composed of sealed Firstfruits wherever they may be today ... and they're not all in that "Living" group!

And if Bob Thiel is "watching" this website: "If you believe you have received, compared to the rest of us, a double portion of God's Spirit: you have again been deceived!"

God is not a respecter of sons and daughters...

John

Anonymous said...

Ultimately, Bob Thiel is going to do what he wants. That has always been the case. I'm just speculating, but I got the feeling that the heir apparent, Doug Winnail, or those close to him wanted to distance from Thiel. After such a long time of having cart blanche in what he writes, his ego just could not take it. We all know how big that ego is.

Allen C. Dexter said...

What delusion! I'm thankful it's about double portions of some kind of spirit and not bigger ammo clips and drums like other deranged people have. He's just another alpha male primate determined to be top dog. He'll bow to someone like Rod as long as they don't try to rein him in.

Anonymous said...

Excellent point!

Douglas Becker said...

Well, it certainly be a blessing for anyone to leave or be kicked out of the LCG.

Nevertheless, Booby Thiel's narcissism lives and he's still at it with Baron Karl zu Guttenberg. When is this guy ever going to stop? If I were Karl, I'd get a restraining order.

Remember though, just because Thiel leaves one particular delusion, it doesn't mean he's sane, particularly when he holds on to all the other psychotic delusions and tries to persuade the world that it's reality.

Maybe he can take up the belief that people living inside a hollow earth come out of the North Pole in flying saucers -- it's all science fiction fantasy without the science part.

Douglas Becker said...

Thiel seriously needs a theme song.

Should it be, "I'm on My Own" or "I Did It My Ways"?

Douglas Becker said...

Hey wait just one darned minute!

It doesn't look like Thiel commented on Washington State voters passing two laws: How could he miss the opportunity?

In the Old Testament, gays were to be stoned.

Washington State gives new meaning to this: Pass around a joint after the wedding!

Byker Bob said...

Who didn't see this one coming?
Merry Christmas, Dr. Thiel!

BB

Byker Bob said...

How does one go about nominating something for the Guiness Book of World Records? Like the church which has experienced the most splinters and schisms?

BB

Painful Truth said...

He will start his own ministry. What's the option?
Join Packs or Flurries cult?

Anonymous said...

BTW, Bob Theil definitely monitors this website. Not sure if daily, but certainly regularly.

Anonymous said...

I have absolutely no doubt that Thiel checks the comments here- his ego counts on it if nothing else. It would be great if his pages allowed comments, but that will never happen.

Douglas Becker said...

Maybe he was anointed with motor oil.

DennisCDiehl said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Eric said...

I like what you wrote Dennis!
So moving and I couldn't agree more especially with the last paragraph about using our wealth to bring everyone's standard of living up to an equal level. It makes me wonder if TPTB are suffering from modern diseases like dementia and schizophrenia seeing they seem to make the same stupid decisions as their predecessors i.e. go to war, restrict our rights, increase surveillance in society, tax more, spend more on useless projects, etc rather than focusing on the basic needs of their people like food, health, clothing, shelter, education. This could be paradise if only everybody knew it *sigh*

Anonymous said...


A split between Rod Meredith and Bob Thiel would make good sense.

Rod Meredith should distance himself from Bob Thiel for wasting time on Mayan prophecies, Kenyan prophecies, Catholic prophecies, etc.

Bob Thiel should distance himself from Rod Meredith for changing doctrine on what the true gospel is, where the marriage supper will take place, what the great falling away was all about, etc.

Anonymous said...

A split between Rod Meredith and Bob Thiel would make good sense.

Rod Meredith should distance himself from Bob Thiel for wasting time on Mayan prophecies, Kenyan prophecies, Catholic prophecies, etc.

Bob Thiel should distance himself from Rod Meredith for changing doctrine on what the true gospel is, where the marriage supper will take place, what the great falling away was all about, etc.



Innocent bystanders might want to distance themselves from both of these guys.

VonHowitzer said...

I sure hope ol' Bob Thiel didn't take that "double portion" stuff too seriously.

As I recall, just about every ordination, from evangelist down to assistant deacon in charge of bathroom cleanliness, included the request for a "double portion" to be visited upon the ordinee.

Take yourself too seriously and you end up full of double "stuff".

VonHowitzer

Anonymous said...

If you aren't a member of the ministerial aristocracy, keep your theological hobbies to yourself. Never, ever, draw public attention to yourself that should be going to the Leader.

Bob was a useful tool- educated, yes, but still nothing more than a laymember who unfortunately tried to rise above his station.

Bob was always such a self-righteous prick. I would like to say that his exit from LCG is a good thing, but it really isn't. Bob is one of those Anointed Robot Pharisees who will eventually form his own little ministry out there in the firmament of the internet.


Paul R

PS...Merry Christmas everyone!

Anonymous said...

One lesson in all of this is that it proves Rod Meredith doesn't actually care about the spiritual welfare of LCG members. He's just in it for the money.

Dr. Bob has been pushing his ideas within LCG for more than a decade. He has offended hundreds of current and former LCG members with his pride and arrogance, and with his public pronouncements, like those after the Brookfield massacre, that have made LCG look like a sick and confused organization.

If any ordinary LCG member, who wasn't a big, big tither, had acted like Dr. Bob, you can be sure that the ministry would have put him or her in their place very quickly, and not allowed such arrogance (the man seriously thinks he's a prophet!) to develop and fester and affect others around him.

Meredith, however, was more interested in receiving Dr. Bob's tithes than in giving him the counsel and correction he needed. So, he praised Dr. Bob, and criticized those who left LCG over disagreements with Dr. Bob.

To Meredith, LCG members aren't future God-beings, deserving of both the respect and the teaching that implies is necessary. Instead, they are present-day ATMs from which he desires to extract as much cash as he can.

DennisCDiehl said...

When I said I'd enjoy lunch with Bob, I merely meant it in the sense that I enjoy talking and sharing with educated and intelligent folk who at least think outside boxes. Bob and I would never agree on the origins and intent of many things Biblical of course.

I went back and read COGwriter a bit and there is an air of smugness and arrogance that I am sure he does not see though he has probably been told it often.

There are no special people and certainly no chosen ones. Just people.

I wish you all a restful and meaningful holiday however you see it. The next year should be more of a challenge to keep content and positive.

We are ultimately all star dust and all used to be very close in the singularity :) How scary is that!!!

Douglas Becker said...

One lesson in all of this is that it proves Rod Meredith doesn't actually care about the spiritual welfare of LCG members.
He's just in it for the money.


Wrong!

But it is easy to see why you would think that (because of the heavy influence of Herbert Armstrong and the example of such cult leaders as Ronald Weinland).

It's about ego.

Roderick Meredith is a narcissist. Actually, it's worse than that -- given he has a contextual conscience -- he's a sociopath.

He's not as interested in the money as he is being the center of all Creation.

In the Kingdom, you can be sure he'll give God a run for His money....

Wait! I'm not sure that last statement came out right....

Anonymous said...

Amazing the rather large (and ever-expanding) number of COGer's now currently under the illusion that they have been specifically chosen and raised up by God to be some kind of a special prophet.

And I'm talking only about the ones who've gone public with their fantasies - imagine how many more there are who secretly harbor such imaginings within the privacy of their own minds?

Like I've observed for many years, underlying and very serious undiagnosed mental illness seems to be extremely widespread in all the various WCG splinter groups.

Frankly, I'm surprised sociologists haven't considered some kind of in-depth academic research about this community, because it seems it could yield a potential goldmine of information regarding the functionings and malfunctionings of the human brain.

Anonymous said...

COG leaders are probably in it for BOTH the money and their personal private reasons, the income flow simply serving as a means of funding their narcissistic tendencies.

Many have noted that fundamentalist religious fervor seems to be principally about two root things: money and mind-control - an analysis I very much agree with.

While religion is presumed to be about humility, at least on it's surface, in reality much of it is actually far more about sublimated desires of extreme self-exaltation and feelings of self-importance.

I'm wondering if anyone here recalls HWA's claim back in the late '60's that the IBM 360 computer (which the Church's data processing department used at that time) was envisioned and brought into existence solely for the purpose of finishing the "end-time Work of God."

I mean, just think about this and many other similar statements that were regularly made with much bluster by HWA and other leading ministers - that in hindsight are astoundingly self-centered. It seems individual narcissism easily morphs into organizational narcissism.

Douglas Becker said...

Our egocentric chronic mental disorders,
are straight from our cult leader's headquarters.

We'd go for therapy and be cured if we could,
But frankly we stay this way 'cause the money's too good.

DennisCDiehl said...

"....'60's that the IBM 360 computer ..."

I recall when NOTHING significant came about in 1972 HWA made the church getting to advertise in Readers Digest the big event.

I remember that scripture..."In the last days, when knowledge has been increased, the Son of Man will come into a Digest of Readers and then shall the end come.."

or something like that somewhere. It's in the Bible.

Douglas Becker said...

Isn't the Readers Digest in bankruptcy.

It just seems that anyone who had dealings with Herbert Armstrong came to no good end.

Assistant Deacon said...

People leaving and/or getting kicked out of any of the COGs is no longer news. It's not shocking, interesting or remarkable. Predictable, yes. But little else.

Marie said...

How did Meredith change doctrine on what the true gospel is about?

Anonymous said...

"How does one go about nominating something for the Guiness Book of World Records? Like the church which has experienced the most splinters and schisms?"



The Catholic Church?

Douglas Becker said...

It may not have occurred to the Armstrongists, but Herbert Armstrong is dead.

He was a false prophet and none of his prophecies came true during his life time.

Some of his prophecies failed before he made them.

Herbert Armstrong is dead.

Did you all catch that?

His timing was not just a little off.

Herbert Armstrong is dead.

And yet, the Armstrongist cult leaders and ministers still hold fast to his disproven mistaken ideas and knowingly teach lies.

It wouldn't be quite as bad if they were just mistaken and would just admit it like Harold Camping did, but they won't and they are as guilty as sin.

So, here's the deal: Herbert Armstrong is, like, dead... really dead.

We all have to live with that.

Herbert Armstrong is dead.

Lake of Fire Church of God said...

Dennis said, "I wish you all a restful and meaningful holiday however you see it. The next year should be more of a challenge to keep content and positive".

MY COMMENT - Yes it will Dennis. I am no profit (Ooops, I mean "Prophet"), but 2013 is already looking like a tough year ahead. Many in the business community are already saying we are in recession again. The fiscal cliff is causing some contraction. The Great Depression of the 1930s was a "double dip" recession, and this economy going back into recession without full recovery from the last one will qualify it to be known as the Great Depression II, in my humble non-prophetic opinion.

Richard

Lake of Fire Church of God said...

Anonymous December 24, 2012 9:45 AM said, "I'm wondering if anyone here recalls HWA's claim back in the late '60's that the IBM 360 computer (which the Church's data processing department used at that time) was envisioned and brought into existence solely for the purpose of finishing the "end-time Work of God."

MY COMMENT - Anonymous, yes I recall that verbal statement made by Mr. Armstrong. He also stated on many occaisons that radio and television was invented to broadcast the gospel into all the world as a witness, and then the end shall come.

Others after Mr. Armstrong I am sure say the same about the creation of the Internet.

Richard

Byker Bob said...

Bob falls into another identifiable stereotypical category of people normally "called" into Armstrongism.

We're all aware of the "fraidy Frannies", who joined Armstrongism to save their own asses from things which were said to be coming soon. We also know of the numerous afflicted ones who came into WCG expecting healing and normality. But, there are also those, who upon their first visit to a Bible Study in a rented Mason or beer hall, aspired to be up there on stage with their briefcase, their Bible, and their little pitcher of water answering all of the carefully screened questions. Frankly, that latter category is probably the only one in which participants actually received what they sought from Armstrongism.

BB

Anonymous said...


Marie said...
"How did Meredith change doctrine on what the true gospel is about?"



HWA had taught that the true gospel was the good news of the "soon coming" (as HWA would add) kingdom of God. While there were many other things to be taught, the true gospel was only about the kingdom of God.

Roderick C. Meredith and his LCG came up with a hybrid gospel by taking the idea that Jesus came to die for our sins and ADDING it to the gospel of the kingdom of God that HWA had taught. RCM then whined that the Protestants had missed HALF of the gospel by not knowing about the kingdom of God part.

Some people think RCM has brought Paul's double curse on himself by teaching this different, hybrid gospel.


Assistant Deacon said...

"Some people think RCM has brought Paul's double curse on himself by teaching this different, hybrid gospel.

Not thinking people, mind you; they're too busy living in the real world to give a damn about such nonsense.

Byker Bob said...

HWA always attempted to clearly define, or actually redefine, a debate. When you do this, you stack the odds of appearing to win in your favor. Intelligent people who can see through this, will walk away in protest, removing themselves from the equation. So, you are left with HWA + those who agreed to the redefinition to resolve the debate.

Here is one thing I've never been able to wrap my mind around. HWA stated that he preached the same gospel that Jesus did. He defined this as being the good news of the coming Kingdom of God. Yet the disciples clearly preached salvation through Jesus Christ as part of the great commission. In fact, how can you preach any type of gospel without including the fact that Jesus Christ died to pay the sin debt of humanity? It is what John 3:16 is all about, among other profound scriptures. So, if Meredith has added this to what HWA taught as the gospel, I'd have to say that he was correct in doing this! Jesus made statements, such as "I am the way". Jesus, as the Son of God incarnate, to a large extent, made the gospel about Himself!

HWA also realized the principle of divide and conquer. Polarization is part of that process. He deliberately polarized himself in any way possible from mainstream Christianity, from COG-7, from progressives, from fresh social trends, and from most positive thinkers. The resulting weirdness factor which made people feel set apart, elite, or holier, was just enough of a hook for HWA to build a financially successful empire from.

I'm no defender of Meredith, but you'll have a hard time convincing me that adding the belief that Jesus saves to the gospel of the second coming is error. That has the capability of greatly enriching people's lives, adding the dimension of love, and diffusing the unneccessary element of fear from the HWA gospel!

BB

Anonymous said...


Byker Bob said...
"I'm no defender of Meredith, but you'll have a hard time convincing me that adding the belief that Jesus saves to the gospel of the second coming is error."



"But he [Jesus] said, 'I must preach the good news of the kingdom of God to the other towns also, because that is why I was sent" (Luke 4:43, NIV).

Besides preaching the good news of the kingdom of God, Jesus ALSO taught in their synagogues, healed the sick, drove out demons, and, to top it all off, died for our sins. But these other things that Jesus said and did were not the gospel. They may have been very important, but they were not the gospel. They were other, additional things.

Jesus said, "And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come" (Matthew 24:14, NIV).

In Mark 14:3-9 you can read about a woman who poured some very expensive perfume on Jesus. When people called it wasteful, Jesus told them to leave her alone and said, "I tell you the truth, wherever the gospel is preached throughout the world, what she has done will also be told, in memory of her" (Mark 14:9, NIV).

Notice that what the woman had done would ALSO be told alongside the gospel. But what she had done was not the gospel or even part of the gospel. It was just something that would be mentioned too.

As HWA noticed, the Protestants typically talk about Jesus (who was the messenger) but do not seem to know anything about the message that He preached. They call the stories of His life in Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John the four gospels.

The apostle Paul wrote, "I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel--which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we have preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned!" (Galatians 1:6-9, NIV).

The true gospel of the kingdom of God is so very important that many WCG splinter groups and slivers are trying to change it. For example, James Malm at his Blog writes about "the true gospel of warning and repentance." James Malm mixed up what HWA had taught about the gospel of the kingdom of God and what HWA had called the Ezekiel warning message. James Malm said that HWA had originally taught a warning gospel but later apostatized and switched to a fluffy and ineffective gospel of the kingdom of God. Of course, it is James Malm who is full of confusion and under a curse--a double curse.