Leaving a cult is exactly like this...
It is not easy to leave a Cult.
I am telling you this by personal experience. When your entire worldview changes, your entire way of looking at life changes, it is a process that literally takes months, years - and decades. No human likes anything related to change. Especially - yes, especially when it involves the core fundamental beliefs of your entire being of soul. In fact, leaving the mindset of a spiritually (and sometimes, physically) dangerous cult can be the hardest and most difficult thing you may ever be faced with a decision to do. But I will tell you, many many years after the initial process, it was the best thing I ever could have done - and I could only do it with the help of Jesus.
I remember very well the very first moments when I began to realize that what I was being told was wrong. At first, every single cellular part of me absolutely rebelled. But it was not a "logic" based rebellion. Because logic was telling me that something was amiss throughout the entire Armstrong experience. The "rebellion" was fear-based. And it was that all-encompassing fear that was resisting the gate to freedom that was right in front of me.
I will tell you everything that I feared in those initial days.
First, I feared that I was "breaking" every command that I had believed that God had given me through the teachings of the Church, and that I had committed to through Baptism and through countless periods of dual Bible-Armstrong studies. I had grown up in the full brunt of the Armstrong Lifestyle. Honestly, I knew nothing different then the do's and the dont's of our interpretation of Mosaic Law. And the interpretation that my family absorbed and practiced was on the extreme conservative, fundamental end of the scale. In fact, my entire childhood in the Armstrong environment was firstly, fear based, secondly, command based, and thirdly, isolationist-based. My entire life during those periods could be based on this one sentence: "Obey, or God will Strike." And by the word Obey, I mean "Do NOT mess up". By the word "God", you could replace that with "The Minister". And it was "The Minister" who ruled our family and our family's every decision. Freewill was not existent in our family in the Armstrong hierarchy. There was plenty of reason due to personal family circumstances why I should be in fear of God or The Minister. So, the Church Doctrines were not, in my mind, debated or even considered to be anything but the highest order of Obedience - our Prime Directive, if you will. For years and years, this is all I knew - and any alternative was satanic, devilish, demonic, and destined to doom me to destruction for all eternity as judged by The Minister.
Second, the only environment I ever knew - due to many circumstances - was the Church. My exposure to the outside world, for many reasons, was severely limited. The only culture I ever knew - was the Church. And Church families - and all the problems associated with Church Families. My entire environment was rooted and cemented in fear. So when I began to open the Bible and to read it for what it said - it could not have been a more polarizing emotional experience.
First, I could not dispute what was being plainly taught by the writings of Paul to the Galatians, Collosians, Ephesians, Philippians and Corinthians churches. Now I know that in the audience here, there are many opinions concerning Paul, and I've heard them all, so try to set aside those for a second. The point I am making is simple: For the first time, when I read these scriptures *without the bias* of Armstrong's interpretations, the points made were shockingly clear. ANd pointedly clear. I read them over and over again, and had no choice but to conclude three words: Herbert Was Wrong.
But how could Herbert have been so wrong? How could he have been so in error? What else did I not know? Eagerly, I began to, for the first time, begin to investigate the secrets of the Church that were exposed by certain individuals who were "in the know". And this was the most shocking revelation of all physical revelations that one could encounter. How could it be that these things could have happened? And if they DID indeed happen - is there evidence to prove they happened?
I quickly found out there were VOLUMES of evidence that proved that what was alleged was not a fabricated attempt to defame. The evidence fit exactly with what was alleged. And slowly, I began to piece together a puzzle that never fit in any way before. Things made sense. The disconnects began to finally form a very ugly picture.
I saw the undeniable evidence that Herbert was wrong in his speculations. I saw the undeniable evidence of fear-based financial fraud. I saw the undeniable evidence of ministerial abuse. I never could, before delving into these things, understand how Herbert, with a rage-ful and angry temperament and explosive personality could be the messenger of a God of Love. This did not make sense! I never could understand the haughty arrogance of ministers that made you afraid of them. Or how snooty and pompous they were. I didn't face these questions because I reasoned that "God's in Charge, He will take care of it." I was in total denial of the questions that I knew I had but never wanted to face because deep inside, there was the idea that maybe, just maybe, I was wrong! But I couldn't be wrong! I was chosen! Called! Special! One of the infinitesimal few who God picked! I was going to be a King! a Leader! Why, if I'm wrong, then what am I? Who am I? So better to shove it to the back, I'd think.
Yet, in time, the realities could not be ignored. I began to realize how intensely we focused on the physical and completely ignored the spiritual. I began to see how much we not only rejected Jesus' teachings, but despised them. I began to see how Herbert had jumbled up the Bible and threw out any ability of understanding context, because he threw EVERYTHING out and based everything on HIS understanding, and rejecting everything else that wasn't how HE saw it. And it wasn't long before I clearly had my answer right in front of me: We were wrong. "I'm out."
Gulp!!!!!
Let me tell you, my absolute fear and panic was extreme the very first time I understood my allegiance was not in obligation to obeying the Old Testament ceremonial and regulatory laws of worship and festivals. When I realized that my salvation is not dependent on food or drink, and that Jesus is my atonement and has made atonement for me and rejected the notion that keeping Atonement had any affect at all on my salvation, I decided not to observe Atonement any longer, and that was the hardest thing I had ever done. Same with Unleavened Bread. I knew this was true, because I can remember that though I was physically following the letter of the law, my spirit was getting more and more spiritually prideful and corrupt. The "better" I kept the letter of the Law, the more prideful my spirit was getting. This happened with every Holy Day and every Sabbath - that haughty arrogance that comes with believing you are right and everyone else is wrong. That you are earning your salvation by obedience to the Law (YES, we believed that, no matter how many times we said that wasn't the case.) That God is going to judge you not on your love to God and Man and following the words of Jesus, but that you ate a piece of food at 7:45 and not 7:48, or had a hidden piece of leaven in the heating register all that time and you didn't know it, and you broke Unleavened Bread because of your negligence. Or the constant wonder if you accidentally broke the Sabbath by doing too much of one thing, or not enough of the other. Or wondering how all that work on the Sabbath was actually okay, because you'd be breaking the Sabbath if you did the same thing at home and not for a Church Potluck. Or seeing a Sabbath Command in the Bible that the minister just skipped over because "it doesn't apply to us" when the minister issues another command that was NOT in the Bible that DID apply. It did not make sense, and I knew it, and no matter how hard I tried, I couldn't get it right, and then it hit me that that was the point. It was about Jesus - so He, and not my observance to ceremony and ritual - was to be my emphasis from that point on, not worrying about days and seasons and years. And again.
Gulp!!!
The initial fears were unfounded. I was not struck by lightning. God's love did not fade. Yes, changing your entire life was, and is, hard. But spiritually? It was the very best thing that ever happened to me - I began to understand the Rest that happens when you surrender to Jesus, whom all of those ceremonies and rituals pointed to in the first place. There is no rest when you are living in fear. There is no rest when your focus is on the physical. The only rest is in the Spirit - and that is only because of what Jesus did for us and how we can now have access to the Throne of Grace and the Father through what Jesus did for all of us. No longer was there that feeling of haughty, arrogant pride because I was doing everything so much better than those evil pagans on the outside. No longer was there that special feeling of superiority. Though many challenges were to come - the lesson was learned. The lesson was the lesson of learning the meaning and the lessons of love. And no observance of any physical ritual will ever give you that Rest that can only happen by thinking, and acting in the love of Jesus in your everyday life.
No, it's not easy to leave a cult. I'm still going through the process of deprogramming - decades later. But if there's one thing that I have now, that I did not have then, while in the cult? It's the fact that I can say, resolutely, that I'm at peace. And I can say that I know Jesus loves, and that the Father cares, and that God has not left me like I had feared. In fact, I can say to you that God has made himself more known to me now than I EVER thought I knew him while in the den of lies that was the cult.
One word, however. You cannot do it alone. But there's good news in a song we all know and love. The four words of that song?
You'll Never Walk Alone.
God said he will NEVER leave you, never forsake you. And you will NEVER walk alone. He's there for you now, He'll be there for you there, He'll be there for you anywhere. We even sang those words in the song we sang "Lord you have searched and have encamped my paths, you oh eternal God know all my ways, If up to heaven Lord, you are there, if down to hell you would soon find me there", or something like that, I'm not looking it up right now. But you know the words, and I'm sure you get the point. And the point is: Jesus will always be your firm foundation, so long as you trust in Him. Life has its challenges in or out of the cult, of this you can be sure. But Jesus isn't going anywhere - He's there. Of that you can be absolutely sure.
submitted by SHT
submitted by SHT
37 comments:
couldn't have said it better, myself, though I've a looong way to go even yet.. Thank you.
One goes through a very similar process when realizing the Bible itself is not the literally true story it makes itself out to be, not written at times by those whose names are affixed and the Gospels are not eyewitness accounts of anything they claim to report on outside of which one probably would never have heard of any Jesus.
It's also a bit of a headsmack to learn Paul wrote, lived and died before any Gospel was ever penned thus the explanation as to why Paul never quotes any Jesus. He never heard of any Gospel Jesus. Paul's Christ was cosmic and hallucinatory, in his head and when he says "Have I not 'seen' the Lord..." he meant in vision and not in reality. When he presents his formula for the Lord's Supper and says that which I received of the Lord...he again means in either vision or hallucination in his head.
Add to this that evolution gets it right, details always to follow and that all life, including human, on the planet has evolved to its present state over the past 4.5 billion years in a Universe that is 13.8 billion years old, and it will get you gyrating in your seats! :)
Every Catholic and Episcopal Priest, as well as well trained Presbyterian or Methodist clergy I have spoken with on all and more of these topics concurs but each has also said, "I can't bring this up in Church else I lose my job" Any properly and honestly trained theologian or theology student will have a crisis of belief in the transition from their Sunday School version of the Bible to the Historical and scientific one.
And it's a good thing :) Reality is our friend....
You might get Dis-Illusioned at first, but who wants to live in illusions???
The opinion above by Dennis, and my post, is a very good example of polarized paths and opinions, and how two people from the same religious background and belief system can be divergent in their opinions, fully convinced in their thinking and opinions - and still get along. Dennis is not changing my mind, I am not changing his, but we respect each other's opinions.
A lesson that many need to learn, in my opinion.
SHT - did you write this?
Dennis - the Exodus presents some major logistical problems, plus the marriage record of Aaron's ancestors does not seem to provide enough time for the multi-million Israelite population. In some areas of the first 5 books, there is a huge amount of detail, in others it seems to skip a lot.
My sheep listen to My voice; I know them, and they follow Me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish. No one can snatch them out of My hand. My Father who has given them to Me is greater than all. No one can snatch them out of My Father’s hand.… John 10:27-29.
Best scripture in the bible. No dumb-ass cult leader can take away your salvation.
Well said SHT and true. I went through the first wake up you speak about as well, and it was rough with lots of drama, confusion and loss, and then the second I speak of which to me was more liberating than the first.
As I read through some of the posting here, I find it difficult to see why people have seem to be so objective of the bible and the way of life it deffinately declares. If we look at the world around us today it should be obvious that there is a definite need for standards that declare what human life should live by if we want to have a life worth living. Even if the bible is written by human beings it portrays what will produce a life that will or should produce a world where all people would enjoy an eternal existence. The bible is a story revealing a beginning along with the way to produce a constructive and productive life worthy of eternity along with the ways of life that are destructive and corruptive that produces death. Even if there is death the person who dies should be remembered for building a more perfect life rather than destroying the perfection others may have achieved. It appears to me that focusing on destroying the bad does very little to improve the good. ASB
TLA - Yes, I am the author of this post.
How long ago did you leave?
SHT: I fixed that. When I post from my phone I am unable to see the end of the posting.
I recall the weekend when I mentally left the church. It had become clear as day that what the church taught, such as blind obedience to a minister, was the commandments of men rather than Gods way. Bible morality and Herb morality are two different universes.
One example. The bible mentions over 50 times the words 'one another,' such as 'love one another,' 'comfort one another,' 'serve one another,' etc. Relationships are two way rather than one way. Never mentioned in Herbs church, and never will be in the splinters.
TLA There is serious doubt on many fronts that the Exodus ever happened and I am being generous with the word doubt. There simply is no evidence even if you remove the sorcery and magic (miracles are magic in disguise) from the story for such a literal event. It is a tale, written by Priests in the Babylonian captivity giving a wee people a huge pedigree
Really good article, pretty spot on. However I think it depended on when you first started to become aware that the church had glaring discrepancies. If it was back in the beginning say the 70s/80s, you kind of kept it to yourself. Anybody who had an actual brain of their own, were not encouraged to question or discuss any doubts they may have without fearing being put out. As a teenager in the 60s and early 70s I would see families come and go and wonder why they left, but they were the lucky ones, they could could see the man behind the curtain was a farce and his message was full of holes. I admit I stayed for all the wrong reasons, I just wanted to save my kids going through the tribulation if there was going to be a tribulation. With my attitude if it were all true I would've been left behind anyway. But I became more and more detached, and when the ministry stopped giving a shit about their congregants, they stopped calling you if you didn't attend, they didn't visit anymore, I made my exit, and no one after almost 40 years ever called to ask me why. They just didn't care and it was really easy for me to stop keeping all the laws and edicts that I found a huge burden and unnecessary. I was a poor excuse of a WCG member after all, not a team player fully. I don't consider my time totally a waste of time, I made lifelong friends and probably reinforced a faith I think I always had. I didn't walk away from God, I walked away from the burden. That was the easy part.
What you said is true however it just ain't that simple, experiences affect people in different ways somepeople were deceived so deeply by cults that it is almost psychologically impossible to be religious in anyway(without the proper help and support). I can't forget about the panic attacks and other psychological problems young and older people related to me they experienced after they left a cultic environment after years of involvement. Its not always that easy to switch on and switch off. Some people lost more, some were more invested, some were more deeply impacted than others, some others have no social support outside their group. Many psychologist are even unequipped to help people seeking help from post cult trauma it's actually that deep. Before my experience i could not comprehend how someone could allow some Church experience to stop them from going back to church. I had a minister try to talk me out of leaving the Cog that I was a member of, it is now ironic that the same minister later left the church because of the same toxic behavior I was disturbed by. The whole point Cults can be like poison to people's souls after which each individual is left to find their own antidote.
I guess the writer must believe that the apostles belonged to a Cult and Jesus was the Cult leader, since they all kept the Sabbath and Holy Days and didn't eat pork.
And Dennis, no scientist who believes in evolution points to evolution having anything to do with the origin of life. Evolution starts with the extreme complexity of micro cellar life including a library of perfectly coded information in the DNA.
Dennis - there do appear to be several scriptures in Isaiah that forecast the Messiah as the suffering servant who died for our sins.
Do you have an alternate explanation for these scriptures?
BTW - there is a scientific theory about B Time - the gist of it is that all the moments in time - the NOWs - past, present, and future already exist, and our brain is processing the time part sequentially. Sounds pretty weird, but sometimes the weird scientific theories get proven.
We like to believe we have the one true religion, but doesn't every faith?
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-46860409
120 million Hindus will make this pilgrimage this year to wash away their sins.
Only 2.4 million Moslems made their holy journey (Hajj) this year.
Christians - we are all over the place with a number of small gatherings and disagreement on where our holy places are.
I am not suggesting we all become Hindus - just that we study and research our beliefs - prove it from the original source materials - which unfortunately are not the originals - how is that for a contradiction?
TLA The context of Isaiah and the Suffering Servant is about Israel. I am sure much of the Gospel Jesus was cobbled out of the OT text , as Matthew did his Birth Story making it seem predictive of Jesus and meaning what it never meant to mean. Midrash and all that.
I propose that there is a "Third Way". Sabbatarianism can be found without the legalism, cultic mindset , ministerial and financial abuse. Also without the apocalyptic falsehoods and predictions, and without the necessity of a "guru , anointed of God" leader.
Without the unaccountable leadership, and handcuffed/unempowered members.
I doubt that it will ever be found amongst Armstrongist groups at any level, or in any group dominated by AC educated men.
The Church of God 7th Day is a balanced, growing and healthy church, free from the above hangups.
It's a lot like the #walkaway movement.
Don't be so shallow most people don't think the Cogs are cultic because of the Sabbath and the holy days that's what some Leaders feed to their congregation. If you think keeping the Sabbath and Holy Days means the group is can never be cultic, you are mistaken. I know members had been thought that the most important thing is keeping the Sabbath and Holy Days, stick to the trunk of the tree, ignore any other issues. A cult is characterized by behavior more so than anything else. Signs of a Cult include.
..Leaders are always right
...Authoritarian Leadership style(they place emphasis on submitting to the leadership over and over until it sticks)
..There's never a good reason to leave
..They maintain their Church is the purest,truest there is (they teach that no one else has the capacity to understand the truth,or bible or doctrines like they do)
..They put heavy Financial Burdens on members(there's always a larger than life project that needs financing)
...Questions and doubts are heavily suppressed(They forbid you reading anything critical of their group)
...opposition to critical thinking
...They usually have a paper trail of records,books and information that documents the group's abuses
...Former members show a pattern of complains of their bad experiences(not just a few but far more than a handful)
E.T.C
The whole point is how they act and behave despite what comes out their mouths how they view and use Authority in the church. Even in 3john1 Diotrephes was condemned for conduct (yet they were the real original church not just pretenders). Let's not not forget that the Pharisees kept the Sabbath and Holy Days. I am with you on the evolution point I think life is too complex to have come from blind chance.
Tonto, one of the biggest problems facing COG7 in the United States is that when former WCGers move to COG7, they bring much of their HWA-conditioning with them, and often cause strife and discord within the congregations they attend. From their perspective they are escaping Armstrongism, but more than they usually realize they are bringing selected parts of their Armstrongism with them.
Unknown
In a nutshell, abusive cults rob members of their lives by systematically stripping them of all their rights. Members right to life is arbitrary, the 'dispensation of existence' thingy. If you are a minister bootlicker, you are granted existence. Otherwise, you are a church slave.
And this what Herbs ministers and their minions have put their trust in. Christ and bible morality can go eat cake.
Even after having left the cult, certain paranoias and attitudes can persist. I’d speculate that as we’ve all watched the worst president in the entire history of the USA destroy himself and degrade the stature of the our great nation amongst our friends and enemies abroad, some would be relating this to HWA’s end times, even if POTUS is a member of HWA’s favorite political party. These must be confusing times for people with Armstrongite attitudes.
BB
"God said he will NEVER leave you, never forsake you."
but apparently you've left Him (based on your posts to this blog)
Dennis, I think you've been reading too much of Richard Carrier and Deborah Murdock.
"but apparently you've left Him (based on your posts to this blog)"
And whoosh, the whole point of the post goes right over the head, as the entire point of the post was missed completely.
No, I haven't left "Him." I've left "him". Small h. Or, small g, whatever or whichever you prefer.
What have I left? Have I left an abusive system? Yes.
Have I left the shadows to go for the reality in Christ? Yes.
Have I left the dogmas of incorrect theology? Yes.
Have I left the oppression of tyrants and bullies? Yes.
Have I left the doctrines of untrained and biblically illiterate men? Yes.
Have I left Armstrongism? Yes.
But no, I have not left HIM. I've left him.That is, Herbert Armstrong and the god he served. Small g. No clarification needed further.
Oh, and by the way, your words and your judgements? They have no authority or base in any sort of spiritual reality. I know exactly where I stand, and I know Who I stand with. Persisting in your judgements will not benefit anyone, except your own preconceived and ill-based conclusions.
Blessings.
"Have I left the shadows to go for the reality in Christ? Yes."
that one line says a lot.
it shows that you've fallen for deception,
it is a common belief in evangelical circles, and those folks are clueless.
maybe you've had a few kooky ministers, I have through the years, but if your focus is on God you can withstand the kooks....they eventually move on anyway.
I've noticed a common problem amongst the "ex-wcg" crowd....they all seemed to be focused on the man HWA, and therein lies the problem.
it's no different from the protestants/evangelicals that follow a favourite minister from church to church...they are simply following a man, and that is a recipe for disaster.
not to worry though, your confusion will be cleared up, you are not doomed.
11:19 -
I'm not confused. My mind is clear on this - it is sad, however, that you are continuing your judgemental attitude towards someone who you do not even personally know - basing every judgement you make about "deception" or my status with Jesus Christ on anything BUT relationship. You are only basing it on what you believe are the criteria of salvation - adherence and obedience to conditional requirements to somehow qualify for something that has already been accomplished.
I'm not going to stand in judgement over you, like you are attempting to try to do with me. I do not know you enough to state exactly what the situation is with you and why it is you seem to be deaf and blind to the concepts I am bringing to light. I will simply state that on these matters I am absolutely certain on my position, and we must agree to disagree. And you are right one one point you have made in your comment. I am NOT doomed, I am saved.
Blessings, again.
11.19 PM
Of course the 'ex COG' crowd is focused on Herb. His church was made in his image. He still rules these splinters 'from the grave.' Or do you believe that a abusive cult church is biblical? Ministers being tyrannical is not 'kooky.' Rather it's ministers robbing members of their lives. That's murder.
What do you think white washing murder say about your character??
"Rather it's ministers robbing members of their lives. That's murder. "
they can only take your life if you give it to them.
like I said earlier, if you are focused on God the kooky minister can't hurt you.
I was always slightly amused by them, and they were puzzled by me...they had no power over me because I didn't try to please them, I try to please God.
we have excellent ministers now, men who are focused on God and not on some power trip thinking they have all knowledge and power...quite the contrary, they are meek, humble men trying to do things correctly, and it shows.
Anon 11:19 PM wrote:
I've noticed a common problem amongst the "ex-wcg" crowd....they all seemed to be focused on the man HWA, and therein lies the problem.
If you want to reject HWA but accept his message, you need to believe that God chose as his primary end-time messenger an incestuous, greedy, power-hungry, narcissistic man whose personal conduct showed disregard for the very teachings he claimed to represent.
Fortunately, Scripture does not show God working that way, so it is both more Scriptural and more logical to reject the message coming from the evil messenger.
"If you want to reject HWA but accept his message, you need to believe that God chose as his primary end-time messenger an incestuous, greedy, power-hungry, narcissistic man whose personal conduct showed disregard for the very teachings he claimed to represent. "
not true at all...HWA wrote none of the bible...you can use his material to help study the bible, some of it was quite good, and some was way off.
materials by some of the later ministers is much better than HWA's, but still, one must judge it by the teachings in the bible.
in other words, it takes diligent study to learn the truth, and one cannot achieve that with out God's help, which brings us back to the calling...and everyone will receive the calling before being judged.
Anon 8:27 AM wrote:
not true at all...HWA wrote none of the bible...you can use his material to help study the bible, some of it was quite good, and some was way off.
Much of what HWA wrote was false. Anything true that he wrote can be found written better, without falsehood, by someone else. Note also that HWA disapproved of the idea of using his material selectively, alongside other commentators' material. If you tried to get by in WCG by explaining that Dugger or Rupert got some stuff right that HWA got wrong, or that the Dugger/Rupert material was better than HWA's, you weren't welcome.
Saudis they ain't And I don't believe that Church eras bullssit
" Note also that HWA disapproved of the idea of using his material selectively,..."
once again, if you are following the man his disapproval will matter to you....if you follow God you don't worry about what any man thinks.
" the Ocelot said...
Saudis they ain't And I don't believe that Church eras bullssit
January 19, 2019 at 8:54 PM"white
**********************
There once was a time that I would agree with that statement, but does the last 100 years or so not fit perfectly?
Rev 3:17 - Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing;
IMO that fit the WCG perfectly, just as it fits the mentality of this entire country!
Kevin McMillen
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