Exposing the underbelly of Armstrongism in all of its wacky glory! Nothing you read here is made up. What you read here is the up to date face of Herbert W Armstrong's legacy. It's the gritty and dirty behind the scenes look at Armstrongism as you have never seen it before!
With all the new crazy self-appointed Chief Overseers, Apostles, Prophets, Pharisees, legalists, and outright liars leading various Churches of God today, it is important to hold these agents of deception accountable.
Herbert Armstrong's Tangled Web of Corrupt Leaders
It was never about meeting world leaders, that accomplished nothing for spreading the gospel. That was only for notoriety. Spreading the gospel is based on a grassroot mission, but most are scared to get their hands dirty.
Even when I was fully steeped in Armstrongism, all of those meetings with world leaders made me uncomfortable. Looking back, it seems obvious that their main purpose was to boost the prestige of Herbert Armstrong and stroke his oversized ego. And, make no mistake, it was VERY expensive! The large gifts to cultural, archaeological, and educational projects in foreign countries (and it wasn't even done in the name of the Worldwide Church). And what about all of those elegant gifts of Steuben Crystal to various world leaders (those didn't come cheap, and Herbie had to be one of their best repeat customers). Finally, think about the private jet (and all of the costs associated with it like maintenance, fuel, flight crew, etc.), and the world class accommodations procured for Mr. Armstrong's visits. All of this cost the tithe payers of the Worldwide Church many MILLIONS of dollars over the course of many years.
Moreover, what was actually accomplished by all of this? It certainly wasn't the watered-down message about the intervention of a "strong hand" from someplace! According to the New Testament, the only time Christ's apostles appeared before the government officials of this world was when they were arrested and hauled before them! Like Jesus, Scripture informs us that Christ's apostles traveled on foot and spoke to assemblies of average folks from all walks of life. So, Herbie's trips did NOT constitute preaching the Gospel or teaching the people about Christ's work. In the end, it was a tremendous waste of resources, and there wasn't any significant contribution to humanity or the fulfillment of the Great Commission.
COMPLETE WASTE of tithes & offerings that went to bribe despots and dictators. No gospel was preached, just worthless blather about " Some unseen hand from someplace" just a phoney dog and pony show that was shoveled out to the membership as spreading the word. Well, it was NOTHING like the gospel preached by the early GENUINE apostles instead of one self proclaimed apostle.
Between 1968-1985 he is said to have met over 300 people all over the world in private meetings and grand gatherings. This was now 40/60 years ago. He never told them of his record of total prophetic stupidity of course as that would have undone the desired effect.
Pretty well most of these people have by now passed on as has Armstrong himself. Fact is nothing was achieved of any Godly purpose because the gospel Armstrong preached being linked solely to his dreamed up timetable and prophetic warning role in coming WORLD GOVERNMENT message and which he was adamant was NOT ABOUT CHRIST - can be shown to be a completely vain endeavor not in line with the scriptures. (If interested highlight/right click/go to - https://qr.ae/pvcrmS it is my best attempt to analyze Herbert-W-Armstrong's claims of preaching the ''true-gospel''.
Dave Pack has never had the wherewithal to meet any world leaders, let alone his own local civic leaders. Ol'Dave in no way compares to HWA even though he claims to have trained at HWA's feet.
Dave barely had initiative enough to honk his loud barrio-style homie horn next to Giant Eagle grocery speeding off in his official-looking s.u.v., as he left RCG pearly gates' secure guarded entrance & passed by Dawn & Marc on that video of them field reporting on assignment, covering the soggy fake open-house meant to meet-&-greet the citizenry of Wadsworth. But Dave did turn on the vehicle's flashy flashers which look like the kind only installed on public service or gov't. security vehicles 🚨
Re the comment ''God used a morally challenged Balaam, so I don't rule out God using HWA. Tuesday, March 26, 2024 at 10:03:00 PM PDT >>
Balaam was a wicked prophet - apparently a non Israelite Transjordanian (Assyrian) diviner/interpreter of dreams. Balak, king of Moab, needed someone to curse Israel.
He is forced by YHWH to bless Israel instead of curse them by humiliating Balaam via the donkey and angel. Balaam’s subsequent seven prophecies were seven blessings on God’s people; it was God’s enemies who were cursed instead. There seems no record of God dealing with this false diviner on any other continuing basis.
Peter (who used the term prophet) and Jude refer to the wickedness of Balaam. Jesus speaks of Balaam when He warns the church in Pergamum of their sin. Balaam spoke true prophecies yet he was a false prophet. Moses eventually had Balaam slain.
Armstrong wasn't a prophet. Nor did he at any time utter one true prophecy, let alone seven as did Balaam. Thus, one may reasonably conclude the story of Balaam is no refuge at all for those persons who pretend they have God's blessing. But fruits show they do not. By their fruits you will know them - not fancy words.
Ever look at how the church spends money now? Very little goes to helping anyone.
These orgs are religious media companies, not anything like a ministry for providing for others. All the media printed is simply commentary and not the word of God. It’s extra biblical speculation and nonsense not leading people to follow Jesus Christ.
I always wondered if HWA or GTA were debriefed after their trips by the US govt. I assume they did, especially Egypt and Asia trips. I can only imagine how big the files were on those two.
I don't know how anyone could even say that God had "used" HWA. The so-called end times message went out, but the end which HWA had visualized never came to pass. The people who were entertained by his broadcasts have mostly passed away, as have the ones who took it seriously enough to get baptized and live a life controlled by the man. Now all that is left are small nostalgia groups of geriatric ones with no major media presence, who talk about holding fast so they won't lose their crowns. The biggest existential threat on the horizon is what we might do to our form of government in the upcoming election.
It was Herbert W. Armstrong's own spoiled, fucking, rebellious brat Garner Ted Armstrong who tried to minimize what his own father HWA had done by calling HWA's visits to many important world leaders over the years “photo ops.”
About the only thing that Garner Ted could get meetings with was masseuses like Suerae Robertson that he had to pay and who then secretly videotaped GTA's bad behavior so it could appear on television news. What a “photo op” that was!!!
I think that most of us realize that, once they went at it, GTA had lost the infrastructure which would have made him his father's natural heir.
As for the "fucking" as you so quaintly put it, (good thing Christians invented that term!) GTA's was public knowledge when the power struggle took place. HWA's which most of us would recognize as even WORSE sin, didn't come out until later. Neither one of those men met the qualifications for a bishop!
The brave Ms. Robertson was GTA's equivalent of both Bathsheba AND Uriah all in one person...GTA was preparing to use (a form of) violence onto her, and (a form of) violence befell Uriah. After exacting violence on Ms. Robertson, GTA's next step would have been to become sexual with her, like Uriah's wife had to do with another fella.
Why would anyone continue to attend any faith services corporately presided by GTA after that 1995 example?
Why are a few responses on here later going to pop & pounce at me instead of onto what GTA did? And for those who support the violence David did over getting Bathsheba, do you wish GTA could have proceeded with having Ms. Robertson sexually? I suppose you'll say she could have bore GTA's offspring to later start up a splinter group...
WOWFJ Piece by HWA with subtitle 'Jesus is not the gospel' is in Dec 1979 PT, a time within the 2300 days before HWA died - Daniel 8:14, 23-25, a prophecy I think HWA possibly fulfilled after checking almost every word/meaning/Hebrew.
Well Dan I learned the other day that staff members from Pan Am were recruited by the CIA since they were flying all over the world so it wouldn’t be much of a stretch if HWA had spook “advisers” either.
"Armstrong wasn't a prophet. Nor did he at any time utter one true prophecy, let alone seven as did Balaam."
Actually the biggest fulfillment of his prophesies is near. A glance at Joe Biden should tell people this. God used Balaam-Herb to warn America before it plunged head long into a sinful lifestyle following WW2.. America's true unemployment rate, children born out of wedlock, national debt etc, was plunging until President Lyndon Johnson in 1964 implemented what was in the nation's heart with his "Great Society" programs. This was the equivalent of Eve eating the fruit rather than working for what one wants. All the social trends reversed. Higher unemployment, more children born out of wedlock, the start of the national debt spiral. At this turning point, when national repentance was easier, God used HWA to warn the country, Now two generations later, America has morality passed the point of no return. The prophesies in the first few verses of Ezekiel 5 of a genocidal military defeat are at the nation's door step. People can't say that a loving God didn't warn them. And yes, He did use a man who went off the moral rails, just like King Saul.
Nice try, 5:59, but the conditions you enumerated are global, and not just restricted to the US and other English-speaking melting pot nations.
In order to be effective, a warning must be close to the punishment or correction. Not everyone heard HWA's message, and most of those who did have long since forgotten it or died. You know how the public forgets after a couple of news cycles. Heck, most people have already forgotten Michael Jackson!
The November election appears to be checkmate for America no matter who wins. Both candidates are making promises which will actually destroy America. I hope you are not deluded in thinking that one or the other of these two men can possibly be the solution. Unless they both die, and a couple good candidates emerge, we're toast.
Concerning Ezekiel 5 the commentary by a believer who applies it to USA today is just sheer silliness by reason of the fact it can be demonstrated that this Anglo Israel theory Armstrong copied is just sheer nonsense and gobbledegook unfortunately peddled by current offshoots such as United and Restored. This theory will never give rise to any prophetic interpretation and people need move on to deeper things leaving childish speculations behind. Same kind of nonsense arose when Armstrong applied Ezekiel 38 and predicted Russia to attack England - that was in the 1940s but people cling to his recycled prophecies because they need to.
HWA wasn’t a narcissistic egomaniac, he was a narcissistic MEGALOMANIAC. I’d be interested in knowing if there is an “Epstein” on any of the records, given herbie’s predilection for young girls (read:Dorothy).
Armstrong was indeed suffered from narcissism which is why he reasoned he was entitled to such behaviors of the types we read and know about whilst at the same time imposing burdens and demands on loyal followers. That he could at the same time pretend he was doing a special work but bereft of any proper biblical foundation . These traits are actually a form of mental illness: read this description of narcissism and ask whether it describes the person in question:
''The hallmarks of narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) are grandiosity, a lack of empathy for other people, and a need for admiration. People with this condition are frequently described as arrogant, self-centered, manipulative, and demanding. They may also have grandiose fantasies and may be convinced that they deserve special treatment. These characteristics typically begin in early adulthood and must be consistently evident in multiple contexts, such as at work and in relationships.
People with NPD often try to associate with other people they believe are unique or gifted in some way, which can enhance their own self-esteem. They tend to seek excessive admiration and attention and have difficulty tolerating criticism or defeat''.
8.37 am Ezekiel 5 was written 700 BC, about one hundred years after ancient Israel had morally collapsed, resulting in military defeat and slavery to the Assyrians. So these verses are not past history, but rather future history.
There are different views as to when Ezekiel wrote. He was among the aristocracy whom Nebuchadnezzar (597 B.C.), after the first capture of Jerusalem, carried off to be exiles in Babylonia (II Kings 24v 14).
During the period of the divided monarchy, an earlier time to the Babylonian captivity and earlier than Ezekiel himself, the name "Israelites" referred to the inhabitants of the northern Kingdom of Israel.
But, this name ''Israel'' came to include the inhabitants of the Kingdom of Judah in post-exilic times and usage. This is clear from a wide number of authorities all one has to do is read and consider.
This change in naming is illustrated in the book of Ezra where we see this ""Jewish'' remnant being called ‘’Jews’’ only eight times - whereas the same people are called ‘’Israel’’ forty times.
In the Book of Nehemiah they are called " Jews " eleven times, and " Israel " twenty two times. Very clearly the earlier naming custom ceased to exist.
The belief that Ezekiel was addressing prophecies to some future non jewish peoples is the kind of silly notions spread by the anglo israel theory because it gives no regard to such facts. One of the silliest of all was ezekiel 38 which refers to jerusalem and nations of the region surrounding being attacked by a alliance involving magog yet anglo israel theorists make this mean russia and allies attack USA.
The Gog and Magog prophecy was aimed at ancient Israel. The nation's mentioned in it were ones known to those living in that period of time. Most of those nations were located in what is now called Turkey. Some of those nations are still in that area. Some have migrated to other areas o f the world. One area Magog didn't migrate to was Russia. The Russians have never claimed Magog as an ancestor. Their Primary Chronicle claims that a Swedish Viking tribe called the Rus was their ancestors. So, so much for Russia being Magog.
As for the Ez. 38 prophecy being fullfilled, read Rev. 20. Gog and Magog is simply the name of the Anti-Christian forces at the end of time.
here is something about future Magog? : Notice now Revelation 20:7-10:
"7 Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan will be released from his prison 8 and will go out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle, whose number is as the sand of the sea. 9 They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them."
"The above clearly takes place after the millennium is over."
Prophecy is part of the fantasy or superstitious element of modern Christianity. Over the years, I've heard Christian people attribute each new trending social phenomenon to Satan beginning to release all manner of demons into the world. And, actually there are more plausible physical explanations. The bath salts threat, opioid crisis, and school shootings were all cited, and now, with the emerging research on gender dysphoria (which has probably been with us for the entire history of mankind, but suppressed) has also been blamed on these demons.
The funny thing is for Hallowe'en, back in the 1950's, parents often "disguised" their children as members of the opposite sex. I remember my Mom dressing my little brother as a girl for Hallowe'en, and the neighbor kid across the street's Mom did the same. Seems creepy in retrospect, I know, but that's the way things were back then.
41 comments:
It was never about meeting world leaders, that accomplished nothing for spreading the gospel. That was only for notoriety. Spreading the gospel is based on a grassroot mission, but most are scared to get their hands dirty.
And this Gospel of don't say his name shall go nowhere...
Even when I was fully steeped in Armstrongism, all of those meetings with world leaders made me uncomfortable. Looking back, it seems obvious that their main purpose was to boost the prestige of Herbert Armstrong and stroke his oversized ego. And, make no mistake, it was VERY expensive! The large gifts to cultural, archaeological, and educational projects in foreign countries (and it wasn't even done in the name of the Worldwide Church). And what about all of those elegant gifts of Steuben Crystal to various world leaders (those didn't come cheap, and Herbie had to be one of their best repeat customers). Finally, think about the private jet (and all of the costs associated with it like maintenance, fuel, flight crew, etc.), and the world class accommodations procured for Mr. Armstrong's visits. All of this cost the tithe payers of the Worldwide Church many MILLIONS of dollars over the course of many years.
Moreover, what was actually accomplished by all of this? It certainly wasn't the watered-down message about the intervention of a "strong hand" from someplace! According to the New Testament, the only time Christ's apostles appeared before the government officials of this world was when they were arrested and hauled before them! Like Jesus, Scripture informs us that Christ's apostles traveled on foot and spoke to assemblies of average folks from all walks of life. So, Herbie's trips did NOT constitute preaching the Gospel or teaching the people about Christ's work. In the end, it was a tremendous waste of resources, and there wasn't any significant contribution to humanity or the fulfillment of the Great Commission.
COMPLETE WASTE of tithes & offerings that went to bribe despots and dictators. No gospel was preached, just worthless blather about " Some unseen hand from someplace" just a phoney dog and pony show that was shoveled out to the membership as spreading the word. Well, it was NOTHING like the gospel preached by the early GENUINE apostles instead of one self proclaimed apostle.
Some unseen hand from someplace
Does that describe his time with daughter Dorothy or with King Hussein?
So, is the final conclusion going to be that hwa was a mason, Bilderberg, illuminatti, etc?
Between 1968-1985 he is said to have met over 300 people all over the world in private meetings and grand gatherings. This was now 40/60 years ago. He never told them of his record of total prophetic stupidity of course as that would have undone the desired effect.
Pretty well most of these people have by now passed on as has Armstrong himself. Fact is nothing was achieved of any Godly purpose because the gospel Armstrong preached being linked solely to his dreamed up timetable and prophetic warning role in coming WORLD GOVERNMENT message and which he was adamant was NOT ABOUT CHRIST - can be shown to be a completely vain endeavor not in line with the scriptures. (If interested highlight/right click/go to - https://qr.ae/pvcrmS
it is my best attempt to analyze Herbert-W-Armstrong's claims of preaching the ''true-gospel''.
HWA's "Unseen hand from someplace" picked your pocket very well, better than any professional pick pocket!
now Dave Pack is the protegé pick-pocketting purple podium panderer
with his new gimmick water glass xylophone speciáles de música
You’re right Armstrong always had the hand extended - to take that is I have more respect for the pick pocket though as he would admit to being one
Dave Pack has never had the wherewithal to meet any world leaders, let alone his own local civic leaders. Ol'Dave in no way compares to HWA even though he claims to have trained at HWA's feet.
I’m an ACOG member, and this is a grotesque abuse of tithe monies and sickens my stomach.
God used a morally challenged Balaam, so I don't rule out God using HWA.
Give long dead Herbert a break, he was most probably in those years only doing what his handlers told him to do.
Dave barely had initiative enough to honk his loud barrio-style homie horn next to Giant Eagle grocery speeding off in his official-looking s.u.v., as he left RCG pearly gates' secure guarded entrance & passed by Dawn & Marc on that video of them field reporting on assignment, covering the soggy fake open-house meant to meet-&-greet the citizenry of Wadsworth. But Dave did turn on the vehicle's flashy flashers which look like the kind only installed on public service or gov't. security vehicles 🚨
Re the comment ''God used a morally challenged Balaam, so I don't rule out God using HWA. Tuesday, March 26, 2024 at 10:03:00 PM PDT
>>
Balaam was a wicked prophet - apparently a non Israelite Transjordanian (Assyrian) diviner/interpreter of dreams. Balak, king of Moab, needed someone to curse Israel.
He is forced by YHWH to bless Israel instead of curse them by humiliating Balaam via the donkey and angel. Balaam’s subsequent seven prophecies were seven blessings on God’s people; it was God’s enemies who were cursed instead. There seems no record of God dealing with this false diviner on any other continuing basis.
Peter (who used the term prophet) and Jude refer to the wickedness of Balaam. Jesus speaks of Balaam when He warns the church in Pergamum of their sin. Balaam spoke true prophecies yet he was a false prophet. Moses eventually had Balaam slain.
Armstrong wasn't a prophet. Nor did he at any time utter one true prophecy, let alone seven as did Balaam. Thus, one may reasonably conclude the story of Balaam is no refuge at all for those persons who pretend they have God's blessing. But fruits show they do not. By their fruits you will know them - not fancy words.
Ever look at how the church spends money now? Very little goes to helping anyone.
These orgs are religious media companies, not anything like a ministry for providing for others. All the media printed is simply commentary and not the word of God. It’s extra biblical speculation and nonsense not leading people to follow Jesus Christ.
I always wondered if HWA or GTA were debriefed after their trips by the US govt. I assume they did, especially Egypt and Asia trips. I can only imagine how big the files were on those two.
I don't know how anyone could even say that God had "used" HWA. The so-called end times message went out, but the end which HWA had visualized never came to pass. The people who were entertained by his broadcasts have mostly passed away, as have the ones who took it seriously enough to get baptized and live a life controlled by the man. Now all that is left are small nostalgia groups of geriatric ones with no major media presence, who talk about holding fast so they won't lose their crowns. The biggest existential threat on the horizon is what we might do to our form of government in the upcoming election.
PHOTO OPS
It was Herbert W. Armstrong's own spoiled, fucking, rebellious brat Garner Ted Armstrong who tried to minimize what his own father HWA had done by calling HWA's visits to many important world leaders over the years “photo ops.”
About the only thing that Garner Ted could get meetings with was masseuses like Suerae Robertson that he had to pay and who then secretly videotaped GTA's bad behavior so it could appear on television news. What a “photo op” that was!!!
I think that most of us realize that, once they went at it, GTA had lost the infrastructure which would have made him his father's natural heir.
As for the "fucking" as you so quaintly put it, (good thing Christians invented that term!) GTA's was public knowledge when the power struggle took place. HWA's which most of us would recognize as even WORSE sin, didn't come out until later. Neither one of those men met the qualifications for a bishop!
Speaking of Herbert and Garner Ted, March 27, 2024 at 10:15:00 AM PDT said:
"Neither one of those men met the qualifications for a bishop!"
We all should be able to say "Amen" with gusto to that!
The brave Ms. Robertson was GTA's equivalent of both Bathsheba AND Uriah all in one person...GTA was preparing to use (a form of) violence onto her, and (a form of) violence befell Uriah. After exacting violence on Ms. Robertson, GTA's next step would have been to become sexual with her, like Uriah's wife had to do with another fella.
Why would anyone continue to attend any faith services corporately presided by GTA after that 1995 example?
Why are a few responses on here later going to pop & pounce at me instead of onto what GTA did? And for those who support the violence David did over getting Bathsheba, do you wish GTA could have proceeded with having Ms. Robertson sexually? I suppose you'll say she could have bore GTA's offspring to later start up a splinter group...
To angry head commentator. I can assure you Garner Ted's mocking was far worse than that. Not to mention the auditorium building jibes.
Stanley Rader had a lot of power in that church.
WOWFJ
Piece by HWA with subtitle 'Jesus is not the gospel' is in Dec 1979 PT, a time within the 2300 days before HWA died - Daniel 8:14, 23-25, a prophecy I think HWA possibly fulfilled after checking almost every word/meaning/Hebrew.
Garner Ted was on John Ankerberg once. Also rumored to be on Hee Haw too maybe?
amen con gusto
GTA was on Hee-Haw. I watched him on that program.
Well Dan I learned the other day that staff members from Pan Am were recruited by the CIA since they were flying all over the world so it wouldn’t be much of a stretch if HWA had spook “advisers” either.
"Armstrong wasn't a prophet. Nor did he at any time utter one true prophecy, let alone seven as did Balaam."
Actually the biggest fulfillment of his prophesies is near. A glance at Joe Biden should tell people this. God used Balaam-Herb to warn America before it plunged head long into a sinful lifestyle following WW2.. America's true unemployment rate, children born out of wedlock, national debt etc, was plunging until President Lyndon Johnson in 1964 implemented what was in the nation's heart with his "Great Society" programs. This was the equivalent of Eve eating the fruit rather than working for what one wants. All the social trends reversed. Higher unemployment, more children born out of wedlock, the start of the national debt spiral. At this turning point, when national repentance was easier, God used HWA to warn the country, Now two generations later, America has morality passed the point of no return. The prophesies in the first few verses of Ezekiel 5 of a genocidal military defeat are at the nation's door step.
People can't say that a loving God didn't warn them. And yes, He did use a man who went off the moral rails, just like King Saul.
Nice try, 5:59, but the conditions you enumerated are global, and not just restricted to the US and other English-speaking melting pot nations.
In order to be effective, a warning must be close to the punishment or correction. Not everyone heard HWA's message, and most of those who did have long since forgotten it or died. You know how the public forgets after a couple of news cycles. Heck, most people have already forgotten Michael Jackson!
The November election appears to be checkmate for America no matter who wins. Both candidates are making promises which will actually destroy America.
I hope you are not deluded in thinking that one or the other of these two men can possibly be the solution. Unless they both die, and a couple good candidates emerge, we're toast.
Concerning Ezekiel 5 the commentary by a believer who applies it to USA today is just sheer silliness by reason of the fact it can be demonstrated that this Anglo Israel theory Armstrong copied is just sheer nonsense and gobbledegook unfortunately peddled by current offshoots such as United and Restored. This theory will never give rise to any prophetic interpretation and people need move on to deeper things leaving childish speculations behind.
Same kind of nonsense arose when Armstrong applied Ezekiel 38 and predicted Russia to attack England - that was in the 1940s but people cling to his recycled prophecies because they need to.
HWA wasn’t a narcissistic egomaniac, he was a narcissistic MEGALOMANIAC. I’d be interested in knowing if there is an “Epstein” on any of the records, given herbie’s predilection for young girls (read:Dorothy).
Armstrong was indeed suffered from narcissism which is why he reasoned he was entitled to such behaviors of the types we read and know about whilst at the same time imposing burdens and demands on loyal followers.
That he could at the same time pretend he was doing a special work but bereft of any proper biblical foundation .
These traits are actually a form of mental illness: read this description of narcissism and ask whether it describes the person in question:
''The hallmarks of narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) are grandiosity, a lack of empathy for other people, and a need for admiration. People with this condition are frequently described as arrogant, self-centered, manipulative, and demanding. They may also have grandiose fantasies and may be convinced that they deserve special treatment. These characteristics typically begin in early adulthood and must be consistently evident in multiple contexts, such as at work and in relationships.
People with NPD often try to associate with other people they believe are unique or gifted in some way, which can enhance their own self-esteem. They tend to seek excessive admiration and attention and have difficulty tolerating criticism or defeat''.
8.37 am
Ezekiel 5 was written 700 BC, about one hundred years after ancient Israel had morally collapsed, resulting in military defeat and slavery to the Assyrians. So these verses are not past history, but rather future history.
There are different views as to when Ezekiel wrote. He was among the aristocracy whom Nebuchadnezzar (597 B.C.), after the first capture of Jerusalem, carried off to be exiles in Babylonia (II Kings 24v 14).
During the period of the divided monarchy, an earlier time to the Babylonian captivity and earlier than Ezekiel himself, the name "Israelites" referred to the inhabitants of the northern Kingdom of Israel.
But, this name ''Israel'' came to include the inhabitants of the Kingdom of Judah in post-exilic times and usage. This is clear from a wide number of authorities all one has to do is read and consider.
This change in naming is illustrated in the book of Ezra where we see this ""Jewish'' remnant being called ‘’Jews’’ only eight times - whereas the same people are called ‘’Israel’’ forty times.
In the Book of Nehemiah they are called " Jews " eleven times, and " Israel " twenty two times.
Very clearly the earlier naming custom ceased to exist.
The belief that Ezekiel was addressing prophecies to some future non jewish peoples is the kind of silly notions spread by the anglo israel theory because it gives no regard to such facts. One of the silliest of all was ezekiel 38 which refers to jerusalem and nations of the region surrounding being attacked by a alliance involving magog yet anglo israel theorists make this mean russia and allies attack USA.
The Gog and Magog prophecy was aimed at ancient Israel. The nation's mentioned in it were ones known to those living in that period of time. Most of those nations were located in what is now called Turkey. Some of those nations are still in that area. Some have migrated to other areas o f the world. One area Magog didn't migrate to was Russia. The Russians have never claimed Magog as an ancestor. Their Primary Chronicle claims that a Swedish Viking tribe called the Rus was their ancestors. So, so much for Russia being Magog.
As for the Ez. 38 prophecy being fullfilled, read Rev. 20. Gog and Magog is simply the name of the Anti-Christian forces at the end of time.
I heard it expounded that the Magog event is near or after the end of the Millenium ahead.
here is something about future Magog? :
Notice now Revelation 20:7-10:
"7 Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan will be released from his prison 8 and will go out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle, whose number is as the sand of the sea. 9 They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them."
"The above clearly takes place after the millennium is over."
"That battle is NOT for our time"
Prophecy is part of the fantasy or superstitious element of modern Christianity. Over the years, I've heard Christian people attribute each new trending social phenomenon to Satan beginning to release all manner of demons into the world. And, actually there are more plausible physical explanations. The bath salts
threat, opioid crisis, and school shootings were all cited, and now, with the emerging research on gender dysphoria (which has probably been with us for the entire history of mankind, but suppressed) has also been blamed on these demons.
The funny thing is for Hallowe'en, back in the 1950's, parents often "disguised" their children as members of the opposite sex. I remember my Mom dressing my little brother as a girl for Hallowe'en, and the neighbor kid across the street's Mom did the same. Seems creepy in retrospect, I know, but that's the way things were back then.
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