Monday, September 2, 2013

Dale Schurter: Now That Dave Pack Has Been Proven A Liar And False Prophet, Why Does He Cover Up For The Liar?




It is now the final day for the great reunification of David C Pack's pipe dream for a united Church of God.

Pack predicted many weeks ago that by the end of August, tens of thousands of Church of God members would be flocking to his church for a great final reunification of the Church of God that would result in the world's most astounding witness ever to happen in human history.

So far, many COG's are reporting that they are NOT losing any members to Dave. Ministers have not jumped ship in droves bringing hundreds of members with them.  The three COG leaders have not died, and that includes Bob Thiel who was never considered one of thee three to begin with.  Bob is nothing more than a pimple on Dave's butt, an irritation perhaps, but irrelevant and unimportant.

In January of 2012, Dave Pack made a huge deal about Dale Schurter defecting from the United Church of God.  Dave, in his usual narcissistic over-the-top bullshit mode, hailed the defection as the greatest event in COG history.

Dale wrote a letter to the COG's membership hoping to influence people into joining Dave's personality cult.  No one did, thankfully. People saw though Dale's bullshit.

Dale wrote:

When we were led to the Restored Church of God, and did due diligence in our research, we confirmed to our satisfaction that the works and fruits of this organization were of God. Christ is the Head of this Church. We saw Christ at work through one He had called and appointed to finish the work --- to fulfill the prophecy of Revelation 10:11, which we should all know, “You must prophesy again before many peoples, and nations, and tongues, and kings.” This prophecy was on Mr. Armstrong’s mind, especially in his latter years.

The first time this was done was in the 20th century. This was the first time it was possible to fulfill such a commission. This was accomplished by God through His appointed leader and support team of the entire membership of the Worldwide Church of God. Now, just before the work of the two witnesses begins, the instruction is for His Church to repeat --- under the leadership He has appointed and sent (one sent from Him) --- yes, under another Apostle --- to “prophesy (preach, proclaim) again before many peoples, nations, tongues, and kings.”

We have found and confirmed to ourselves that the Restored Church of God is just what its name implies. And that Mr. David C. Pack is the one sent, an end time Apostle, through whom Jesus Christ, the head of the Church, is powerfully working.
 Now that Dave his been exposed as a liar and a false prophet, who predicted many things that did not come to pass, WHY are you still supporting the degenerate false prophet?  To continue to hitch your wagon to Dave's death train shows how theologically ignorant you are.  You would rather whore yourself out to a lying man that to follow the "christ" you claim to follow.

Shame on you and The Sixteen other ministers who are sitting there pretending that Dave is still 100% correct.  Shame! Shame!

Michael Venish on the Insidious Man David C. Pack and His Lying Signs and Wonders






Michael Venish has produced an excellent 12 minute video on the insidious liar that is David C Pack.

Venish talks about how Ron Weinland sent Dave a letter a long time ago telling him that he was going to die and how Pack laughed at Ron.  Now Pack is using the exact same message of Weinland to delude his own people.

From Dave's belief that he is a type of Jesus to his outlandish claim that his god was going to kill three Church of God leaders.  

Venish says Pack uses sermons and articles to hook people in like a fisherman reeling a fish.  He wants to make you feel guilty about yourself and your relationship with God.  He wants you to come to him.  Venish says to think about what "spirit" that wants to draw you into him and away from God.

Venish correctly states that it's all about MONEY!

Best of all he pointed calls to task the "ministers" of Dave Pack who stand by and conceal the lies of Dave.  They continue to cover up for his lies.


Dennis Muses: 12 Step Program for Ministry

Mor-On and On Anonymous

 

A Twelve Step Program for Church of God Apostles Prophets and Plain Old Pastors

 

 Why the Biblically Based 12 Step Programs Work - One Day At A Time

I doubt it matters much at all which church a man pastors in as ministry is filled with weird and strange kinds of anxiety and stress.  As we know, in the Churches of God, it is also filled with weird and strange ideas but I am sure that if any minister got off into those, even if he wanted the congregation not to, the people would call him out on them.  Yes...I am sure they would.  If he warned them ahead of time that he was prone to weird and strange ideas, they would remember he warned them and would confront his weirdness. 

 
But another  reality in ministry seems to be as follows.
 

Pastor burnout
 
 
  • 50 percent of pastors reported being so discouraged that they would leave the ministry if they could. (June 2000)
  • 70 percent of pastors report constantly fighting depression.
  • 80 percent of seminary graduates who enter the ministry will leave in five years.
  • 80 percent of pastors' wives wish their spouses would choose another profession.

Aside from the never ending saga of whose True Church of God is the True Church of God and which knuckle head is really an Apostle, Prophet, Priest or Reincarnated Bible Guy,  I have a Twelve Step Program COG ministers might consider.  I know the stress and anxiety they faced and face.  As a pastor, with WCG it was one drama, scandal and rumor after the next.   I got to where I was regretting ministry though I loved the people and at the time, believed the WCG perspective on the Bible.  The organization and administration was another thing.

 I spent a lot of time in various forms of denial or did what most do and called it persecution or Satan "trying" to discourage the church and myself.  It was working very well from what I felt inside.    I disliked going to "Refresher" seminars in Pasadena because they were so freaking exhausting.  I realized they were more "where do you stand" environments than I wanted to believe.  And there were always the weird and strange ideas PLUS the mind numbing and boring presentations that seem thrown together by men who would say "I am too busy to meet with you , but I will."  Busy...bullshit.  I just didn't think they liked to open things up to questions.  In my personal experience I asked just two direct questions to those at "God's Headquartes," and got blown out of the water both times.  That's when I put on my mask.

There were years of Ambassador Reports in the mail and members getting them.  I threw mine out, in hind sight because I was afraid they would be right and what would I do.  I was torn between thinking I was in a place I could not move from and a "calling" that was set in stone and wishing I had never heard of it.  Of course, back then, there was no real place to go in my mind save for the organizations of a few rebels who were more weird and filled with strangeness than where I was.  Walking away, for me, was not an option.  I was young.

Dr. Dave Albert, who I always considered a friend in ministry and went out of his way when I was a WCG ignorant freshman to try and get my New York girlfriend accepted to AC  (thank God that didn't happen)  told me once way back that he never thought I was a good fit for the ministry.  That really threw me.  I thought I was.  In review of that I think he meant I didn't think like most of the ministry he knew and perhaps even like he did.  He tended towards black and white rules and regs.  Those were never my strengths or perspectives.  Life is not all that way nor are people no matter what church they have or church they attend. We were a lot alike when the masks came off.  All ministers wear them you know.  I did and know all others did as well which made me feel better somehow.  I have since upgraded to knowing all humans wear masks. 

So here is my 12 Step Recovery Program for Church of God Lurking Ministers.  What are we recovering from?

...

Our Own Choices in Life
The Myth of the One True Church
The misunderstanding that men can hold positions over us to control and limit the kind of theological information given out
Compliance to ideas that we actually had choices to accept or reject
Going along to get along
Spokesman Club where being evaluated for thought content was the norm
Doing what one was told from on high and not being willing to simply take opinion under advisement instead as taking it as God's Law
Being the baloney jammed between the White Bread of Church Leaders and the members of the Church and smothered in drama sauce and title taking, untrained and small minded non theologians
Theological fairy tales
Education by Booklet
A closed education system
Prove me now here withs
...and the prayer of faith will heal the sick
Send it in
Matthew 24,  Isaiah 14, Ezekiel 28, Book of Revelation
Leviticus 23  and Jeremiah 17:9
Not understanding the conflict between Jewish and Gentile Christianity in the New Testament
Believing that all the New Testament Players all spoke the same one truth and all got along
"There were two trees in the garden..."
The uni plural word "Elohim"
Allowing improperly trained theologians to tell us what the Bible means
Jesus is coming soon
Not expecting accountability in financial matters
Not knowing the difference between actual meaning and concocted meanings
Not labeling openly opinion, speculation and musings about prophecy as such
Allowing men to take titles without qualification or reasonable assurances they are not delusional
Bad ideas unchallenged

 
 
I am sure you have your own lists
 
12 Steps for Ministry Recovery
  1. We admitted we were powerless over alcohol—that our lives had become unmanageable.
We admitted were were powerless over the Bible--that our fascinations had become cultic and majoring in the minors of reality.  The Bible was our obsession and we would do anything to refer to it.

     2.Came to believe that a power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.

We came to believe that the God of WCG/COG was not the only God there was and the Church was not the only church there was.  We came to see there were many ways to understand the Bible and parts that no longer matter no matter what we thought.  We know our sanity can be restored if we just listen listen to the feeling in our stomachs and not the voice in my head.


     3.  Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him.

We made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God because it is ok to understand Him/Her/It as we do ourselves and not just as others told us it all is.  We made a decision to trust our own judgment when we heard bullshit. As I understand God is OK and doesn't have to be as YOU understand God for me.     (Very difficult for RCG members evidently)



Big Book Sponsorship for permanent recovery from all addictions

     4..Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.

We made a searching and fearless moral and theological inventory of ourselves and came to see it is just fine to draw different conclusions from the same Bible everyone else uses as anyone can use it unskillfully proof texting their way into any belief they wish.  We are content to get to know ourselves and be ourselves before we ever let others tell us how they believe we should be.   We don't should on ourselves or must-rabate as this is immoral.

     5.Admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.

Admitted to ourselves first, then to others and then to God the exact nature of our wrong doings, fears, anxieties, doubts , depression and concerns.  (I say in this order  in light of the fact that some ministers have the cornball idea that God corrects them and it is none of your business.) 


     6. Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character.

We are happy to have God remove all these defects of character, but we also realize we have to do our own hard work.  WE have to do the hard work of being authentic in the face of the expectation of compliance.  WE have to do the hard work of defect removal but sometimes have to realize one man's defect is another man's strength..  WE have to listen when others are hurt, offended , puzzled or irritated by our words, sermons, ideas, views and title taking proclivities.


     7.  Humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings.

Humbly do everything.  Not think of ourselves more highly than we ought to think.  Not think we are special in any way.  Understand the heart of a shepherd and a servant does not mean demanding no one disagree with us. Never uttering the crass and insane words, "Woman...you have no say,"  "Pull Big Triggers," "You don't tell God how to spend your money, or his servants,"  or "I am a type of Jesus...." or _____________ (fill in the blank).  Humbly ask those I pastor to help me  stop being fool. 


     8.  Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all.

Admit there ARE humans we had harmed and being willing to make amends is not the ministers choice to exempt himself from.  Admit it is difficult as a minister to utter the words,  "I am sorry,"  "I was mistaken,"  "I was wrong,"  "I don't know everything,"  "I have the same doubts, fears and questions you do,"  and "I was ill trained."

     9.  Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others.

Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others.  Never just say "God knows I'm sorry so that covers it,"  or "I meant to call but..."


     10.  Continued to take personal inventory, and when we were wrong, promptly admitted it.

Continued to study the concept of "when we were wrong, promptly admitted it," all the days of my life and don't retract apologies the next day when your go back to "hey, I'm God's minister, they can't talk to me that way."


     11.  Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God as we understood Him, praying only for knowledge of His will for us and the power to carry that out.

With all respect to prayer and meditation, sought to improve our conscious contact with reality, theological education, the psychology of human beings,  books written by others than ourselves, ideas we did not come up with and observations we did not personally make.  We make a personal effort to understand our world of thought is not THE world of thought.  


     12.  Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.

Having had a religious and spiritual epiphany as a result of the Wild World of God experience, we try to carry this message to the God Haunted Guru Following souls still stuck in the mud and assure them it is just fine to think for themselves, be authentically who you are and vote with your feet to the saving of the soul.  We try to carry the message that you are not defective, your views are valid as well, your concerns are well placed, your doubts are ok and maybe you were actually born right the first time after all.
 

At any rate, lots of stories, feelings, anxieties and emotions went with ministry for me personally.  It's hard to believe all that is behind me at times, but life is only 15 minutes long when you look back as far as I can tell and how it seems. 

"One can always serve as a bad example," applies to all of us at various and sundry times.  But theologically and in ministry, we have ministers, falsely so called, like the Dave Packs, Ron Weinlands, Gerald Flurry, Bob Thiel and other leading but lessor player goof balls to thank for the specific Wild World of God experience.    Recover is possible.  We're all hear to learn and welcome to Earth School...