Recently John Carmack wrote an article on his blog about Herbert Armstrong being declared a false prophet. Carmack attempts to prove that HWA could be no such thing because he never said he was a prophet. Carmack says this about HWA:
You know, I think HWA believed with all of his heart that Christ would return in 1975. After all, the math doesn’t lie, right? His theory of time cycles certainly looked like a sure thing. They probably seemed just as sure as how sure it seemed that Christ would return in the apostles’ lifetimes.
And yet, HWA never claimed to be a prophet. When it was suggested that he was a prophet, he became very uncomfortable. He rejected it, but, as the story goes, Herman Hoeh pushed the idea HWA was an apostle, and for better or worse that was accepted. Whatever you may think, though, HWA rejected the title of prophet, and that is the bottom line.
Carmack then goes on to talk about Gerald Flurry and his self proclaimed prophet status:
Flurry has been pushing his prophet status for many years now. He has hoodwinked his members into believing that so he can have supreme control over them. He he says it then it must be form God.
It does not help, though, that one false “prophet” in his own right wants to proclaim HWA a prophet. Why? The answer is simple really: He himself wants to be a prophet, like so many other sad souls that have gone off and started their own following.
You see, the formula is to get people to focus on a man or an organization instead of Christ. By cheering on reverence for another human, making them out to be more than they were, it become easier to transfer that adoration upon one’s self.
Gerald Flurry made up the lie that HWA was a prophet, so that now HWA is dead he could carry on the “mantle” of being a prophet himself. By lying and saying he is receiving “new truth”, he justifies people going after him.
Carmack then moves on to another COG "leader" who envisions himself a prophet also. This prophet has been rejected by almost all in the Church of God and most particularly by Rod Meredith and the Living Church of God. This has created a bitter little man who cannot stop complaining and whining about it.
Bob Thiel is a little more subtle about his lies, although he recently stooped to Malm-like tactics and twisted some of COGWA’s teachings to seem like COGWA is confused about prophecy (
even failing to attribute a supposed quote, which is one of his common tactics) [edit: never mind, I found it. Apparently, browser search wasn't working properly for me yesterday evening]. Of course, Thiel is a PhD, and they are usually arrogant enough to not believe they are wrong. I’ve worked with a couple of them because of the field I’m in, and it is commonly enough to make you wish they would just go hang out in some ivory tower and leave people who want to do real work alone.
He is Philadelphian, for he himself has redefined the word (after all, he is a PhD) to mean what he wants it to mean, and he has glorified the concept of being with the correct, Philadelphian group. While he was with LCG, that group was LCG. Of course, now that he has planted the idea in people’s minds, it is easy enough to convince the foolish ones that lack discernment that the title of Philadelphian is now transferred to the group he has founded.
In another entry Carmack makes this comment where he says there is no need for prophets today.
As I was getting at, prophets tend to be sent only after a time of serious continual problems…Will there be another? Well, there is the Elijah to come, and only die-hard lunatics believe it was HWA. Simply put, they are wrong and history has shown it. HWA is dead. Christ has not returned. Period. End of proof; all you have to do is open your eyes and your common sense.
Does this Elijah to come have to be one of the Two Witnesses? No, there is no requirement for it. Some believe he will be, but frankly I think the Two Witnesses are going to be rather busy. Not only that, but when those in Jerusalem flee, who is going to be in charge of that group? The Two Witnesses stay in Jerusalem!Do we need a prophet now, today? Apparently not, else God would have already sent one. There isn’t one. Period. …
That last comment has particularly perturbed Bob Thiel. Thiel has been working over time these past few years in attempting to "prove" he has great prophetic understanding. He spent countless hours with Rod Meredith attempting to get his great knowledge across. While Meredith stroked his back for a while he has now publicly rebuked Thiel in all aspects.
Thiel is not happy about that and also fails to understand why NO ONE in the Church of God pays any attention to him.
How can people like John Carmack insist there are no prophets now? Haven’t their been continual problems in the COGs over the past couple of decades or so?
The New Testament clearly lists prophets as an office and discusses them in many places.
John Carmack’s firm denial of the possible existence of any prophets now is evidence that he and others like him would not recognize a true prophet of God. But his denial is similar to those of other groups such as LCG.
Theil feels that he knows what is wrong in the COG's and that he has the answer. He points out at least 29 different things he sees wrong in the COG's.
Does the Church of God need any prophets now?
Well, if one looks at the disarray of various groups, personal and doctrinal compromises, the increase of Laodiceanism, and prophetic misunderstandings, the clear answer is yes.
As far as prophetic misunderstandings in various claimed COG groups that I have personally denounced...
Since Thiel is trying to get across to all his readers that HE and HE ALONE has the prophetic understanding, he attempts to drag Rod Meredith back into the fray again. Thiel's extreme bitterness towards Meredith's rejection of him grows stronger day by day.
- Many COG groups do not officially teach and/or do not believe in the idea of Church eras
- Becasue many no longer preach a "gospelf of the kingdom" to the world, Thiel feels they "...do not have the Philadelphian work. Only the Philadelphians are promised to be protected from the hour of trial that will com"
- Many, if not most, COG groups do not realize that the Great Tribulation begins with the King of the North invading the USA. UK, and/or their Anglo-Saxon descended allies
- Various COG groups (UCG, COGWA, COGaIC, RCG, and CGOM, come to immediate mind, but they are not the only ones) have so many areas of undefined prophecy that they will not know what certain events will mean. (Of course PhD Propeht Bob is here to correct these wayward miscreants.)
- Most COG groups fail to understand Habakkuk 2:2-8 and hence are not properly getting the warning out to the USA and UK
- Many COG groups have various ‘Elijah heresies.’ Because of this, they will not be able to recognize the final Elijah (Which translates in ME, since Thiel has slyinly been trying to prove he is Elijah)
- Most groups that came out of groups once led by the late Garner Ted Armstrong (ICG, CGI, CEM, etc.) do not seem to teach that there is a physical place of safety, hence will not be inclined to flee towards one
- At least on COG group (CG7) basically teaches that most of the events of Revelation have already taken place and no one needs to worry about coming persecution. (for the full list go here.)
Only HE has the right emphasis on what needs to be preached:It should be noted that leaders once in the old WCG and now in the Living Church of God and/or the United Church of God confirmed to me personally that I was biblically correct on all the above points, despite the fact that their respective churches hold to several of the errors pointed out above.
Thiel continues on with his tooting of his own horn:There are also more prophetic differences that other COG groups have from the Bible than shown in this post. The reality is that without the right emphasis on the final phase of the work, holding the Bible in sufficiently high regard, and ignoring one anointed like Elisha, the COG groups that ignore prophetic warnings are doing so to their peril.
Theil ends his whining list by trying to prove that Rod Meredith said he was a prophet and that his group is the ONLY true Church of God in existence today. Thiel is still trying to prove that his "double portion" of the Holy Spirit further legitimizes him.At COGwriter.com there have long been articles on dozens of claimed COG groups explaining how they have deviated from Philadelphia era teachings. And nearly all of those groups are Laodicean. And the differences included not only areas of prophecy, but also other items of doctrine, church history, and biblical truth.
Additionally, God has allowed my articles on defining Philadelphia and Laodicea to have been published in places such as the Global Church News, Living Church News, and The Journal:News of the Churches of God. These articles were and remain a witness.
Oh Bob, give it a rest.At this moment, the only COG-group that possibly can understand when the Great Tribulation will begin, based upon the Bible and basically the later understandings of Herbert W. Armstrong and what all the COG groups teach, is the Continuing Church of God. The Continuing Church of God is also the only group led by a person told by the longest surviving evangelist originally ordained by Herbert Armstrong that God may consider him a prophet (this occurred in 2008) and the only person known to have been anointed and prayed to be granted a ‘double-portion of God’s Spirit by a minister who told him that this was reminiscent of the passing of the mantle to the Prophet Elisha by the Prophet Elijah (cf. 2 Kings 2:9-13).
God has also confirmed the validity of the mantle being passed to dreams to at least three people, all of whom later became part of CCOG. The witness is there for those with eyes to see.