Evolution is NOT the Origin of Life
Dr Robert Thiel
“These mysteries about how we evolved should not distract us from the indisputable fact that we did evolve.”
― Why Evolution Is True
― Why Evolution Is True
“Many people require more than just evidence before they’ll accept evolution. To these folks,
evolution raises such profound questions of purpose, morality, and meaning that they just can’t accept it no matter how much evidence they see. It’s not that we evolved from apes that bothers them so much; it’s [[the emotional consequences of facing that fact.]] And unless we address those concerns, we won’t progress in making evolution a universally acknowledged truth.”
― Why Evolution Is True
evolution raises such profound questions of purpose, morality, and meaning that they just can’t accept it no matter how much evidence they see. It’s not that we evolved from apes that bothers them so much; it’s [[the emotional consequences of facing that fact.]] And unless we address those concerns, we won’t progress in making evolution a universally acknowledged truth.”
― Why Evolution Is True
“To many, evolution gnaws at their sense of self. If evolution offers a lesson, it seems to be that we’re not only related to other creatures but, like them, are also the product of blind and impersonal evolutionary forces. If humans are just one of many outcomes of natural selection, maybe we aren’t so special after all. You can understand why this doesn’t sit well with many people who think that we came into being differently from other species, as the special goal of a divine intention.”
― Why Evolution Is True
― Why Evolution Is True
“This book lays out the main lines of evidence for evolution. For those who oppose Darwinism purely as a matter of faith, no amount of evidence will do—theirs is a belief not based on reason. But for the many who find themselves uncertain, or who accept evolution but are not sure how to argue their case, this volume gives a succinct summary of why modern science recognizes evolution as true.”
― Why Evolution Is True
― Why Evolution Is True
22 comments:
Dennis, have you actually read Coyne's book? It's 1000% better than anything the Pathetic Prophet of Possiblys has preached, but it isn't a great text for converting Creationists into Evolutionists. Why not? Coyne ironically falls into his own version of a "god of the gaps" approach, except that he attributes to Evolution any number of phenomena that science doesn't yet fully understand. "Evolution of the gaps" is the unspoken motto in Coyne-world.
For instance, look at his treatment of retroviruses, which he says produce "junk DNA" in a manner that would be improbable to have evolved separately in chimpanzees and in humans. He just plain gets it wrong, as science has advanced in the last decade and showed that the stuff he dismisses as "junk DNA" actually plays a role in the governance of our genome. Because of Coyne's flippant assurance, he has given the "intelligent design" folks further ammunition for their cause, where if he had remained an honest scientist in his presentation he wouldn't have overplayed his hand.
Coyne is a better polemicist than Thiel, by far. But he is still, sadly, a polemicist and should be taken with the proverbial grain of salt.
Evolution is NOT the Origin of Life
Dr Robert Thiel
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
MY RESPONSE:
Getting anointed for being sick , is NOT the ORIGIN of being a Prophet!
I am a theistic evolutionist. In brief. I believe there is a god. I also believe that god used evolution to proliferate and adapt species. Evolution is nothing magical or enchanted as an argument against god. It is a physical mechanism - mutation and natural selection as the engine for speciation. It nicely explains what geneticists find in the genomes of fauna and flora. Lastly, there are a number of ways of approaching the Genesis narrative that do not require solely creation by fiat.
Jerry Coyne is an outspoken atheist. But if evolution is just a biological mechanism and can be accommodated within Judeo-Christian belief, what then is his atheism founded on? It is actually founded on "metaphysical naturalism" which I prefer to call materialism although they are not fully synonymous. This belief, in its simplest form, is that the only evidences are material evidences and if god is not material, he does not exist. As you can see, materialism leaves something to be desired.
This ball has been kicked around for centuries. A good counterpoint to Coyne is John C. Lennox, Professor in Mathematics and Philosophy, Oxford University. He has written a number of books. He is particularly trenchant in his elucidation of the deficiencies of materialism or naturalism.
Dennis - you still are not considering a different theory - that we are a simulation.
There are TED talks about this.
I read the book by Jaynes, which attempts to explain the gods of the past.
If we are a simulation, then the controllers could have changed the rules of the simulation - moving the simulation from being ruled by the supernatural to ruled by science.
I have been reading up on testing labs - do you think the scientists have any concern about the lab rats, dogs, monkeys, as beings with any rights? They do terrible things to them as part of their experiments.
Obviously I could chosen to quote from hundreds of evolutionists . The quotes are meant to show how uncomfortable, and understandably so, people are with the topic of evolution. Coyne said it well.
I am not promoting Coyne as the one true way of explaining evolution. I simply quote his observations, as a scientist, that understands the trouble many have wrapping their heads around the reality of our evolution as opposed to the pathetic presentation Bob Thiel offers to "prove" that evolution is not true. Bob fails miserably and always will.
Evolution is true not because Coyne says so his way, but because the preponderance of the evidence that all of the sciences have gathered tell us so.
And again, the point is that Bob Thiel is not only mistaken but his faith restrictions limit his ability and desire to leave magical thinking and elves out of the picture. His way of proving it all to others falls more than far short of convincing. "Let's look over here at this scripture" is simply not going to undo the reality the evolution of all life including us, details always to follow.
Dave Pack had more personal charisma and dogmatism behind his mistaken notions in his Creationism vs Evolution series. Aron Ra took Dave apart as could any trained paleontologist, geologist, biologist or cosmologist among others of course.
My point is that Bob's faith restrictions cause him to present this topic of scientific inquiry extremely poorly convincing no one. Like any Bible literalist, he presupposes his already drawn conclusions so is never going to come to a knowledge of the actual truth of the matter. You know, "God said it. I believe it. That does it for me. Now let me show you how right I am about how God thinks and did it all" as if he ever could know such a thing.
Everything Bob does is miserably inadequate and of very low standards. He has become a joke and that alone should be insulting to God to have such a bumbling idiot claiming to represent him.
The believers in Evolution abound greatly on this blog, it's a pity they don't believe in integrity, honesty and being true to thyself when they occupy the pulpit.
Of this topic but still Bob Thiel, his latest screed is milking COVID-19 to the last drop.
The believers in Evolution abound greatly on this blog
Anon 12:55 PM seems not to understand the difference between "belief" and "evidence."
Evolution has been observed. God hasn't been observed.
Even on the relatively small scale at which it has been observed, its phenomena are objective and sufficient to let scientists make their case, and if they make a bad inference they fix it when they get further evidence. The "God did it" crowd points to all sorts of phenomena, but has never been able to prove objectively whether the credit goes to Allah or YHVH or Thor or Cthulhu, and if you guess wrong, the winning god will burn you forever!
Evolution has been observed at a small scale, and reasonably inferred at a larger scale. You don't need to "believe" in evolution; you just observe and interpret the objective facts you find. The "God did it" crew has nothing but belief, as it cannot even agree as to which god did it.
@ 1:47 PM, Bob wrote:
We look like we are close to entering an age that one cannot buy (or sell) if one will not wear a mask.
I guess Bob would have predicted the Second Coming after similar measures were enacted during the Spanish Flu pandemic a hundred years ago. Some prophet!
Only idiots consider masks to be infringement of their rights.
besides being sensible (reducing risk), they show consideration for others - love your neighbor as yourself - a principle in both the OT and the NT.
With Dr. Bob's admittance in this video that he has been selling "dead" amino acids for "years",the listener wouldn't be making a giant leap to think; am I having conveyed to me a dead message or one that is alive.
If we add in Dave Pack's reasoning on how God works, the subject of evolution becomes clear. Dave Pack said recently that "God anticipated there would be moments of clarification or at times complete u-turns in understanding" and "we may have to test several scenarios before coming to a full understanding of God's intent".
So according to the two "true" ones, dead amino acids, anticipation, clarification, complete u-turns, tests, scenarios and intent were the exact recipe on how God pulled off creation via the trail of evolution.
By the way, when do we get the live message from these two? You know, the God that has lived for eternity, the God that lives now and the God that is going to give life message?
TLA, if it's unconstitutional for the government to require the wearing of a body-covering, then shouldn't it be illegal to refuse doing business with those who shop topless or bottomless?
one cannot buy (or sell) if one will not wear a mask
I buy a lot of things not wearing a mask, and haven't been stopped yet -- at least not by Amazon and local grocery store with parking lot pickup...
Anon 5:07pm - I guess it would depend how pretty you are. LOL
Anyway, you seem highly confused.
I wrote people should wear masks.
I never mentioned anything being unconstitutional.
To be an atheist requires FAITH. I lack that kind of FAITH.
I like cartoon Bob better. When is he going to make an animation of a himself wearing a mask?
Strawman argument. You attempt attention away from the point of my comment. But thanks for the publicity towards it.
If God exists, why would he be threatened by evolution? No, it's these so called "men of God" that are threatened by evolution because they don't understand it and they believe it somehow leaves God out, as if that were possible. Besides, evolution is not a theory so much about the origin of life, but the progression of life.
Hoss said:
"I buy a lot of things not wearing a mask, and haven't been stopped yet -- at least not by Amazon and local grocery store with parking lot pickup..."
What if you're an asymptomatic carrier and every breath you exhale expels viral particles to anyone you come into contact with?
Anon 546, I think Hoss's point is he shops online. Different kind of virus, heh?
I agree DBP.
Perhaps God was looking for a cure of something and by accident invented man as a redundant byproduct that after some thought proved to be quite humorous to observe every million year or so. Like a petri dish gone rogue.
Every now and then he says to get rid of that old petridish and then a bacteria like Noah or Moses says something funny and he decides to let it grow for another thousand years.
Lets see what happens when it all gets to crowded in the lab. Should be fun to watch on a cosmic scale and you can end it all once this Elon microbe starts breaking out to Mars.
Yeah my little fly friend, you've taken it too far now. Whooosh.....
Nck
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