Retired teacher Bert Otten, who was once part of the old WCG, sent me a paper with his reasons why he feels that many ‘Western Vikings’ are the descendants of the biblical tribe of Benjamin. He told me that I could edit and/or use what he sends in any way.
Here is some of his article:
The tribal area of Benjamin was a buffer area between the House of Israel and the House of Judah. People tended to stay in their cities and homes and thus a number of the Benjamites were taken along into the Assyrian captivity of the Ten Tribes. …
Vikings in the British Isles
During the Viking Age many Vikings settled in the British Isles. Many Britons have some Viking blood. … Vikings from Norway circled the whole and came from the north and settled in Scotland, Ireland (Dublin), Wales and the Isle of Man. Benjamin embraced Joseph in the Bible and in a sense Benjamin embraced Joseph on the map and mixed with Joseph.
Thanks to the Vikings we now know where the words come from when we talk about the berserk COG leaders and the ugly muck they continually thrust upon us in their sick quest for power! Again, Who knew!
Linguistic Loans
No wonder that the English language has many Old Norse loans: anger, awe, are, berserk, call, cast, egg, fellow, fog, gap, get, gun, happy, husband, ill, kid, kindle, knife, knot, law, leg, loft, low, mire, muck, odd, outlaw, wrong, wing, window, whirl, weak, until, ugly, trust, till, tidings, thwart, thrust, thrift, though, their, teem, take, sway, sick, etc.
There are three Rachel tribes: Ephraim, Manasseh and Benjamin. The Rachel tribes camped west of the Tabernacle, under Ephraim’s leadership. I believe that the western Vikings (from Denmark and Norway) are descendants of Benjamin and ended up in Denmark, Norway, Iceland and the Faeroe Islands. Ephraim and Manasseh ended up in the British Isles, all three far to the west.
Quite a few Vikings settled in the British Isles. Many Danes settled in Normandy, which got its name from the Norsemen. Many of these Normans (with Viking blood) crossed the Channel with William the Conqueror (1066) and settled in the British Isles too. So, in the Viking Age many Vikings went west.
Norse Vikings
About 500 years before Columbus (1492) and the English (1497), the Norse Vikings arrived in America. The Norse Vikings sailed their ships westwards to Iceland, Greenland and Vinland (New Foundland, Canada). The Viking colony in Greenland survived for about 450 to 500 years. The Viking Benjamites were the first in the New World and the first of the Israelites to go west. Later on to be followed by many others of the Lost Tribes.
Benjamin is A RAVENOUS WOLF, in the morning devouring the prey, and at even dividing the spoil.” (Gen 49:27, RSV).
Jewish Encyclopedia
The Jewish Encyclopedia states about this: “[According to the rabbis]: His comparison to the ravening wolf (Cant. R. to viii. 1), “who devours his enemy” (Gen. xlix. 27) is referred to the men of Shiloh who stole their wives (Judges xxi.) or to Ehud or to Saul. By others it is referred to Mordecai and Esther (Gen. R. xcix. and Tan., Wayeḥi, 14; so also in the original text of the Testaments of the Twelve Patriarchs [Benjamin ii]; whereas a Christian interpolation refers it to Paul). …
Vikings – wolves
There is no people that fulfilled this verse as the Vikings did during the three centuries of the Viking Age. In gangs they attacked early in the morning in hit-and-run style, and at evening they divided the spoil. The common sword of the time was the Ulfberht sword. Ulfberht probably was the name of a bladesmith or of a group of bladesmiths. Ulfberht translates into English as Bright Wulf.
Benjamin & Violence (Sword)
There are tribes that are quite peaceful, like Asher, Zebulun and Issachar. Then there are militaristic tribes like Ephraim, Gad and Manasseh. The tribe of Benjamin was often involved in violence. That’s why Jacob prophesied Benjamin to be a devouring wolf.
Lefthanded Ehud single-handedly killed the king of Moab. The men of Gibeah raped a woman a whole night long so that she died. The Benjamites did not want to hand over the culprits, so they started a civil war of 1 tribe aginst 11 (Vikings avant la lettre). Abner, Saul’s army commander killed Asahel with a backwards thrust of his spear. Saul fought 40 years for his kingdom and died on the hills of Gilboa with his sons. Jonathan conquered a Philistine outpost all by himself and Saul/Paul persecuted the church with the sword.
Benjamites are good organizers and kingdom builders. At the time of the judges Israel was a loose confederation of tribes. There was no central governance, no king. God used the Benjamite Saul to build the kingdom, which was later taken over by the House of David. …
Paul was instrumental in building that Church with his missionary journeys and his epistles. Paul wrote 13 of the 26 NT books. Paul was an able organizer and he was of the tribe of Benjamin. …
Vikings – organizers & kingdom builders
Vikings were not just plunderers in hit-and-run actions, but also good organizers. Otherwise they would never have been able to make these long journeys. …
Benjamites (Vikings) are good organizers and kindom builders. The Scandinavian kingdoms today are well organized states.
Then our amazing prophet makes this mind-boggling declaration that seals the above speculation as fact:
Perhaps I should add that my wife and I have been to Iceland once.
WTH????? What does this have to do with anything? I have stood at the crossing of ley-lines in England where ancient Celts and Druids had sacred places on which Christian churches exist today, but again, who cares? But, I am not a true prophet sent by god in this perilous end times to preach the truth lost for 1,980 years. Sigh....
Our Icelandic visitor ends with this:
While there are various ways to look at those and other prophecies, let me conclude by stating that I do believe that those of Iceland and Norway are essentially descended from biblical Benjamin, though there is ethnic intermingling.
As far as Bert Otten goes, he tends to be more of a Messianic than a Church of God leader, but we do have some points of agreement.
That being said, knowing where various peoples have come from, help us better understand how the Bible teaches that various ones will be affected by end time events that are still to come to pass.
That's a load of bullshit! While knowing about speculative mythology and history may be eternally fascinating, it has absolutely NOTHING of value for any follower of Jesus. This is just more crap to get in the way of people who should be told about Jesus and how to practice grace, love, and mercy as they make the kingdom of God tangible in the world around them, today. Sadly the COG movement places its emphasis in minor irrelevant things instead of focusing upon the bigger things in which they seem to be eternally embarrassed.
If this kind of mythology interests you, then check it out here: Bert Otten on Western Vikings as descendants of the Tribe of Benjamin
20 comments:
What about the Viqueens?
Dang! I feel the pain in someone's butt in Arroyo Grande tonight! Well done!
None of that stuff about the Vikings being the Tribe of Benjamin was reaching me until I learned that the bent over, doubly b-blessed prophet had actually been to Iceland - that was the entire key to understanding this vital truth. Without that knowledge of Bob's travels, I'm not sure my eyes would have been opened to the truth illuminated in the trailer for the "Norseman" - of course the Vikings were the Tribe of Benjamin; it is so plain now!
Chieftain Olav is obviously a COG Pastor-General type, like Weston, dealing with a COG full of mostly gullible sheep, like LCG. Most of this Viking-COG tribe unquestionably accepts the wisdom and skill of their leader. However, just like in modern COGs, there is always some Satan-inspired trouble stirrers who need to be put in their place. Just like Weston has had to do recently, Chieftain Olav needs to remind the congregation that it is all about government and he is the head of that government. When Olav admonished, "Who dares to boo their own chieftain?" chills ran through my body - that was just like Weston!
The Monty Pythonesk video is funny.
One of my very favorite quotes of Jesus was
"To you it is given to understand the mystery of the Tribe of Benjamin becoming the Vikings, don't ask, in Scandinavia, don't ask, retaining not a hint of Torah or Holydays, Sabbath or the Kingdom of God. But to them it is not given. For seeing, they don't see. For hearing they don't hear. Neither should we care I suppose, never mind."
Bob's way of explaining origins is shallow, cartoonish, childish, naïve and of course, for the scientist he claims to be, incredibly unscientific.
For an explanation of current views of Viking origins that will be way too much information but more credible, see:
http://www.davidkfaux.org/CentralAsiaRootsofScandinavia-Y-DNAEvidence.pdf
Bob's method of determining ethnic identity seems to be matching characteristics and idiosyncrasies attributed to certain biblical personages. Another gambit is matching groups to biblical events and end-time prophecies; for example, Bob writes that prophecies about Samaria are actually about the USA because we're doing what Samaritans were prophesied to do. And California is being singled out for destruction by fire for LGBTQxyz legislation, references to Sodom and Gomorrah. Yet The Netherlands, Canada, UK, Australia and other "BI descent" countries are considered far more "Gay-Friendly" - where are the fires??
This guy needs to stop playing with HWA's jigsaw puzzles and get direct revelations like Flurry - Gerry claims his cup runneth over with fulfilled prophecies!
The claim that Vikings are the tribe of Benjamin is most certainly false. I will list some of the issues:
1. Geography does not determine race, genetics does. The Vikings out of Scandinavia migrated west around the coast of western Europe and also East through the river system in Russia. The Vikings in the east later settled in Russia, Belarus and the Ukraine where they were known as the Rus'. To say that these Scandinavians of common ancestry were Benjamites when they went west but Gentile when they went east is a disingenuous attempt to conform with modern Armstrongist notions about which nations are Gentile and which Israelitish.
2. The modern people of Norway (thought to be Benjamin) are a mix genetically. They are not a single genetic grouping nor are they mostly a single genetic grouping. The top four haplogroups in modern Norway are:
I1 - 37% - Early hunter-gatherers; I1 mostly in Scandinavia; related I2 in Southern Europe
R1b - 31% - Later Pastoralists; Genetically like Celts
R1a - 26% - Later Pastoralists: Genetically like Germans, Eastern Europeans, Russians
N - 4% - North Eurasian related to Siberian tribes
To assert that this mix of people somehow represents a single tribe is untenable.
3. A Chief Captain of the Roman band had the following exchange with Paul (Acts 21:37-39). The chief captain, as an officer in the Roman Army, would be familiar with many of the racial types in Europe, North Africa and the Middle East. He would know the difference between a Northman and a Middle Easterner. Paul was a Benjamite.
"[The Chief Captain asks:] Art not thou that Egyptian, which before these days madest an uproar, and leddest out into the wilderness four thousand men that were murderers? But Paul said, I am a man which am a Jew of Tarsus . . ."
The officer thought Paul, who according to Armstrongist theory should have looked like a fair skinned Scandinavian as a Benjamite, was a North African. Paul had to identify himself as a Jew. The inevitable conclusion is that Paul was a swarthy Middle Easterner - a dark skinned Jew - apparently darker than most. The Benjamites were essentially Jews in appearance unlike blonde Northmen. The Roman officer did not look at Paul and say to himself that this is one of those blonde people who are numerous in Palestine and known as Benjamites. Instead he concluded immediately that Paul was an Egyptian by appearance alone. While this is admittedly a small sample - just one person, this event in Acts, taken with the supporting genetic evidence, makes a formidable argument against the Vikings being Benjamin.
Come on! Everyone knows that the VIKINGS come from MINNESOTA!
the VIKINGS come from MINNESOTA!
And NASA sent two Vikings to Mars.
I had a kid in my class who looked a bit like a Romulan. Are the Maoris related to Klingons?
Embracing Joseph? They had a funny way of doing it.
VI Kings signify the period after the 6th King or 6th head of the Beast of revelation appeared but before the 7th head becomes obvious to all will be the Age of the VIKINGS. This is no minor group of Purple People Eaters either.
How did someone (probably Herman Hoeh) in the WCG develop the idea that Benjamin was to be identified with Norway? I perused an archive of old WCG writings to get a hint and found only a couple of short paragraphs.
I found the following from an article titled "Location of the Tribes of Israel" written by Herman Hoeh in 1957:
"Benjamin constitutes Norway and Iceland. The Icelandic people in reality a colony of Norwegians. . . Benjamin is compared to "a wolf that raveneth; in the morning he devoureth the prey, and at even he divideth the spoil" (Gen. 49:27). . .
"Here we have a recapitulation of Jacob's prophecy for the latter days, and of Moses' blessings (some of which apply to the millennium). IN ALL THE WORLD THERE IS NO GROUP OF NATIONS SO PERFECTLY CORRESPONDING TO THE PROPHECIES."
I omitted some unnecessary detail. The evidence consists of a bold assertion supported only by the observation that in a couple of prophecies Benjamin was characterized as violent and the Vikings were violent. Obviously, the subjective reasoning goes, they had to be the same people.
This is embarrassingly thin as any kind of research on a topic so important to the internal structure of Armstrongism that it is touted as "the key that unlocks Bible prophecy."
"To assert that this mix of people somehow represents a single tribe is untenable."
Yet geneticists say that we all come from one man and one woman who lived over 100,000 years ago. Even so, NEO knows for sure that related individuals can't have several haplogroups.
How did someone (probably Herman Hoeh) in the WCG develop the idea...
In my early WCG days I asked similar questions regarding the non-Joseph tribes and got the usual vague answers and references to booklets, reprints, sermons...
Many defunct blogs ago, there appeared a post on how HWA needed some answers for these questions and had Dr Hoeh "research it" and write it up. He came up with an article you may have seen (and I forget the publication, title, date, etc).
Of course Dr Hoeh did the same speculative matching as Bob Thiel. I think one tribe (the one that became Finland) was matched because Finland was the only country that repaid the WW I reparations debt to the US.
Again, jigsaw puzzle research methods...
In case it was not recognized as such, I was being facetious about VIKINGS above.
It's been noted, perhaps in Orr's rebuttal of BI, that Allen viewed his work as showing the blessings, whereas HWA saw the use of prophetic curses. All of this convoluted who's who has to do with prophetic scaremongering. Matt 24 wasn't good enough, or rather, not specific enough.
I mentioned the apocalyptic stirrings of the RNC to a colleague, and said mainstream churches aren't using the pandemic to that effect, they're only whining about masks. My colleague told me her (mainstream) church was holding prayer sessions and fasts for the COVID victims.
The matching corresponds with the post WWII international world order as shaped by the USA through the UN system.
The USA and its Nato "cousin" allies. That pre WWII hated each others guts because of the Boer War, burning of the White House, colonialism, or isolationism (usa).
I leave you to conclude, since 3 of my postings got censored or didnt make it from my current remote dwellings.
Nck
I knew you weren't serious but you missed an opportunity when talking about the seventh head, which was obviously the VIIKINGS!
i SHOULD HAVE BEEN MORE EXPLICIT. LOL
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