Reasons vs. Excuses

The Bear (The Big Dipper)

Recently I posted a bit more on, w my perspectives on the Astro-theological nature of many of the stories and prophecies in the Bible. Astro-theology is based on the concept of "as above, so below" where over time humans have seen the story they need to see and tell in the movement of the constellations thru the signs of the zodiac and along the ecliptic from season to season. I mostly do this to give a different perspective to all our background in the Bible as understood by the Churches of God and most others.   Most cultures have done this over thousands of years and the writers of the Old Testament and New, in particular the Book of Revelation were no exceptions. 

As I have said before, the night sky was the Netflix of the times.  It's where you got your stories and brought them down to earth to explain life and "all that up there" to yourself.  Job was challenged that if he was so smart could he do or know the following

Job 38:31-33

"Can you direct the movement of the stars--binding the cluster of the Pleiades or loosening the cords of Orion?

(we know today what binds this and Orion is not held by cords.)

Can you bring forth the constellations in their seasons or lead out the Bear (The Big Dipper)  with its cubs?

(We know they bring forth themselves because the earth rotates which gives the impression of movement in the heavens when it is we who are moving)

Do you know the laws of the heavens? Can you set up God's dominion over the earth?

(We're getting there nicely)

We also know where snow , hail and rain come from and how they form. Contrary to Bob Thiel's archaic view that weather is still "God's way of trying to get our attention."  To which I have always said, "God has to try?"

Job 9:9

Which maketh Arcturus, Orion, and Pleiades, and the chambers of the south.

Orion with Shield and Flaming Sword held high

(There are no chambers in the South. Only locations.  Arcturus, also called Alpha Boötis, one of the five brightest stars in the night sky, and the brightest star in the northern constellation Boötes, with an apparent visual magnitude of −0.05. It is an orange-coloured giant star 36.7 light-years from Earth. The Pleiades is visible star cluster and Orion is a Constellation of the Winter sky. Orion is probably also the Angel placed in the East with a flaming sword to keep Adam and Eve out of the Garden of Eden but I spare you. It never occurred to them evidently to sneak back from the North, South or West. Orion rises in the East.

The fact is that today all the challenges of the Book of Job, by God to Job are pretty well understood.  Today we'd have to challenge Job that if he was so smart, did he understand quarks, muons , the Cosmic Background Radiation and the double split experiment.  And aside from the average person who could care less, we do understand these things as well.

I was very sincerely sent a long paper on how the heavens DO explain the entire plan of God through the movement of the Sun and constellations through the Zodiac (Ecliptic) tell the story of our salvation and it was God who put it there for us to understand.  In my view, it was man who evinced the story of his salvation and theology by imagining what he thought he saw in the constellations , seasons and journey of the sun through the year with the light and dark cycles as well as times to plant and reap.

I know it is hard to accept, and can be argued until proverbial cows come home,  but the SUN is the original God Most High (Noon) in human history. It is the SUN that is born on Christmas day.  It is the Sun that takes away the darkness (sins) of the world at "Easter", when it comes up due East and the days are now longer than the nights at the Equinox (equal days/nights). Even the Pass-over over is when the SUN passes over this line in the seasons. 

I only include this final exchange to illustrate the conclusion of this exchange.

There are vast differences between REASONS and EXCUSES

In religion apologetics are the excuses of theology. It is when you simply can't admit to being mistaken about something Biblical and must keep it so to keep one's beliefs, which are not the same as truths, intact. IMHO

2000 years ago reasons given outside of Biblical perspectives were considered excuses to rebel against God as understood in that day.  With increased knowledge of how things actually are, excuses must yield to reasons to think outside the boxes of the past.  Just as 2000 years ago, those who asked "where is the promise of his coming" were called scoffers who would get theirs in time, so today we'd simply see they were noticing the obvious.  No one who notices Jesus has not returned "soon" after 2000 years cannot be called a scoffer. They are simply noticing what is evidently and obviously so. 

So it is with where many of our theological concepts and stories come from in reality.

On 12/23/2017 12:19 PM, denniscdiehl@aol.com wrote:

I am a great believer in the astro theological nature of many bible tales. I just don't believe the origin is God putting his plan in the constellations.

--------------------------------------- 

Dennis,

"If that is your belief, then please tell me what was God's intention for creating the heavens and universe? There MUST be a reason, for God does nothing without a purpose in mind."

-------------------------------

On 01/03/2018 12:07 PM, denniscdiehl@aol.com wrote:

"Actually we humans come up with the concept of "there must be a reason" etc. The fact is the universe and our evolution from ape ancestors to conscious of our mortality does not care and we are not special in it any more than earth is special will billions of them out there just being discovered. 

I don't believe in the existence of the bible God. That is a literary and human construct to help us cope . I don't believe it took a god to bring the universe, which may also be just one of billions to pass. It's a huge topic but I go with science on this stuff"

                                                                           

---

                                              Dennis,

"I'm sorry, but I didn't realize you were an atheist. Based on your website, I always thought you were part of the COG. With that in mind, I won't bother you any more. I have no desire or time to converse with anyone who doesn't believe in a Creator God.

Romans 1:19-2019 What can be known about God is clear to them because he has made it clear to them.
20 From the creation of the world, God's invisible qualities, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly observed in what he made. As a result, people have no excuse. (GWN)
Dennis, you have NO excuse."

Exactly!  they are reasons......

COG False Prophet Claims "Perilous Times" Are Here As He Once Again Suffers Intense Persecution From So-called Anti-COG Blogs and Websites

Out favorite self-appointed false prophet is having another hissy-fit over the Painful Truth website calling him out for his lies and sophistry.

Of course, this is just a sure sign that Satan is on the march and is using all of us to persecuted God's one and only end time man.  No other COG minister is doing a bigger work that this guy.  No other man has held onto proper church governance and doctrines than this guy.  No other COG is being persecuted like Not-arrested, but almost arrested, Elisha, Elijah, Amos, Joshua, Habbakuk, Mayan guru, and closet-Catholic Bob Thiel.

The persecution of Not-arrested, but almost-arrest Thiel is so intense that it was foretold in Scriptures:

But those who hate what we stand for do not care. 

Jesus said:

10 Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness’ sake, For theirs is the kingdom of heaven. 11 Blessed are you when they revile and persecute you, and say all kinds of evil against you falsely for My sake. 12 Rejoice and be exceedingly glad, for great is your reward in heaven, for so they persecuted the prophets who were before you (Matthew 5:10-12)
12 Now brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; and children will rise up against parents and cause them to be put to death. 13 And you will be hated by all men for My name’s sake. But he who endures to the end shall be saved…” (Mark 13:12-13).
3 And these things they will do to you because they have not known the Father nor Me. 4 But these things I have told you, that when the time comes, you may remember that I told you of them. And these things I did not say to you at the beginning, because I was with you (John 16:3-4).

Notice also the following prophecy:

1 But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: 2 For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3 unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, 4 traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away! (2 Timothy 3:1-5)

Bob Thiel is a liar.  He is not being persecuted for righteousness sake, he is being mocked because he is a self-appointed liar.  That is a fact that everyone knows, from Rod Meredith to Gaylon Bonjour, to the rest of the Churches of God.  The man is a fool.

Butt-hurt Bob continues with this:

The Painful Truth site is falsely convicting me of sin that I am not guilty of. They will not accept the truth, but instead spew out lies.

Do not believe them or others who put forth hate and falsehoods.

Butt-hurt Bob was incensed over this posting:

The Year Ahead. Bob Thiel and the ACOG’s.

One of the PT editors recently made this statement to me: “Bob Thiel is guilty of a shocking display of dishonesty and sophistry.” I confess to a similar sentiment, but as it is, Thiel, who is a peddler of Herbert Armstrong’s fictional and failed prophecies, is generally considered by the ACOG community as  a huckster and poses little threat if he is constantly challenged and kept in check. He certainly does not display the honesty or character of Ian Boyne, who allowed people to challenge his thoughts and his writings.

Just for the record, the Painful Truth does not attack those who hold a religious belief. Rather, we wish to expose those who we consider to be false teachers who live at the expense of others. Keep in mind always, that evil prevails when good people do nothing.

With this short article, we want to share with you our view about Bob Thiel’s malignant beliefs and what damage we can expect in the coming year. We would not have to do so if Thiel allowed comments at his website where we could challenge him and refute his writings. 

I am quite sure Butt-hurt's Bob's followers in Africa are very sincere people who want to do what is right, at least most of them probably do.  The problem lies in the FACT that Bob Thiel is a liar. God no more doubly blessed him through the hands of Galyon Bonjour than the nightmares of two different people in different parts of the world legitimized his self-appointed "ministry." Thiel is no more preaching "first century Christianity" than Dave Pack or Gerald Flurry are.  They are all liars that are deceiving the brethren.

The question that the Painful Truth posed for Bob still remains:

Can he, will he acknowledge his own insularity and excesses, or will he continue down the path of smug self-congratulation and vanity, never passing up an opportunity to destroy, debauch, devalue, and dehumanize a wide assortment of innocent people?

The Saddest Thing About Betrayal Is That It Never Comes From Your Enemies

A comment from the "Is it possible to have a true friendship with another in the Church of God?"

I was in LCG for years and had so many friends. I threw baby showers, bridal showers, cocktail parties, bbq's and endless dinner parties for my "friends". We traveled the world together, shared condos for the Feast of Tabernacles, went through pregnancies/births together and spent all of our social lives with one another (it is frowned upon in LCG to have friends that aren't in the church).

For me, it was all gone in a spit second. These people, who I thought genuinely loved and cared about me, turned their backs on me as soon as I was no longer in LCG. I was de-friended by people with reckless abandon (it sounds trite but it was hurtful). I would reach out to people and they would refuse to reply to my messages. I was shunned repeatedly when I'd run into long-time LCG friends in public. Suddenly, all these supposed "Christians" who were my "brothers and sisters" regarded me with more disgust than their superior asses view the "people in the world".

To this day, I can not conceive of how they twist things in their infantile minds to think that what they did to me was in any way "Christ-like". I mean seriously, can you imagine our Savior advocating such disgusting behavior? No way!

If you are reading this and you are in LCG you are no exception. If you leave you will lose all of your friends. You see, the relationships are CONDITIONAL. People in these churches appear to be incapable of grasping the concept of unconditional love (let alone mercy or forgiveness). If you are telling yourself, "nah, that would never happen to ME" you are so deceived. It would happen to you as it happened to me and many, many others.

My favorites were the "friends" that replied, "I want to be a pillar in the Kingdom so I love you, but..." or "you will always be my brother and I love you, but..."

Guess what LCGers, love is a VERB. It requires action not just words.

I have never met a more fake, self-righteous group of idiots in my life. I am desperately ashamed that I wasted over ten years of my life with those people.

I fear for them because they will reap what they have sown and more importantly because they do not know the love of Christ.

LCG is the antithesis of the COG.