Prophet Thiel: Occupy Wall Street A Sure Sign of Endtimes

The Prophet speaks!  Heed his words! 

Armstrongism still needs to find the bogeyman in all world events.  It's no wonder their little cults are not growing!

When I watched some o of the “Occupy Wall Street” protesters/leaders interviewed, the following sections of scripture came to mind:

1 But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: 2 For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3 unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, 4 traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away! 6 For of this sort are those who creep into households and make captives of gullible women loaded down with sins, led away by various lusts, 7 always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth. (2 Timothy 3:1-8) 8 For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be earthquakes in various places, and there will be famines and troubles. These are the beginnings of sorrows. (Mark 13:8)

We are living in the last days and at least some of the protesters seemed to be fulfilling much of the above. The London riots and the flash mobs in the USA this past summer also brought these verses to mind. The sorrows and troubles are just beginning (Matthew 24:5-8) and will get much worse (Matthew 24:21-22). I believe that class warfare and other protests will help weaken the USA and other Anglo-nations and may also be a factor in them being vulnerable to real warfare: invasion by the Beast. (I also suspect that protests and civil unrest in Europe will be factors in the actual rise the Beast, as he will be a militaristic leader cf. Revelation 13:4.) As Jesus said:

Dennis On: A Final Realization About Forgiveness

A Final Realization About Forgiveness

If it is one concept that religious people are familiar with, either by choice or by force,  it is FORGIVENESS.

Here is what I wrote about the topic the last time I faced this demon believing I had reached the final stage in dealing with my own perspectives, consequences and losses in pastoring in the World Wide Church of God.

"There is one solution that seems to be the last one we really want to employ. Somehow, we inherently know that if we apply it and mean it, it will free us from all the drama/trauma. Mostly we don't know how to do it and find that what we intend to be a permanent solution to the painful life experiences we have, is merely temporary. The ultimate solution to our perverse chemistry of reliving, over and over the negative emotions that hurt mainly ourselves is FORGIVENESS.

Forgiveness is either the easiest thing on earth to do and we just don't get it, or it is the most difficult. I sometimes feel that if I forgive whoever or whatever it is that still plagues my mind at times, they or it will be getting away with something. If I forgive them, they will for sure! 

If I FORGIVE, they will win. So not forgiving ensures they don't. My ego, my "little self" will want to get even, or be right, or get an apology or just keep on fighting on and on what is or was. On the other hand, allowing things to be as they are is really what we call GRACE. The rest is all just memories and chemistry in MY head. It is not real.

I remember when a past Pope forgave, very publically, the man who put a near fatal bullet in him. I remember thinking that since the Pope is a professional forgiver, or has to be, it was not the magnificient example it was meant to be. The Pope has to forgive you! Now if the father of Nick Berg, the first American beheaded in Iraq, forgives that evil act done by those evil men, that is real! I undestand that Mr. Berg is just such a remarkable person, or wants to be inspite of the pain of those events.

 If you offend your pastor , or friends in the church in some way, just tell them "well forgive me." They have to!  He's a minister and it's a Church!

I want to forgive for my sake. Of course, there are a few things in life I want to be forgiven for as well as there is a chemistry of guilt or shame set off when I think of those things and don't stop and accept myself as just human like everyone else. Many ministers feel they have to give the impression they are past all that and do no wrong, or admit to little wrongs to appear human, but everyone has "the other side." Every minister I know wears at least one mask...

Forgiving comes in stages. I suppose it can be instant and final but mostly it comes in increments in practical fact. We forgive so that what eats us doesn't destroy us. We forgive because somehow we know that we all can be just as foolish or hurtful as we feel others have been towards us. We forgive because what else is there is to do and have a real life. We forgive to see how life can bless us for doing so and that things do work out exactly as they should for us.

Forgiving has to be specific and not generic. You can't forgive an organization or an all encompassing Church denomination. Abused Catholics can't forgive the Catholic Church or even the Pope. They must forgive the specific abuse, priest or member. I can't forgive the Worldwide Church of God. I have to forgive the players who created it, took advantage of my good intentions and spiritual seeking and changed it from something I could relate to, when I took the Bible as literally true, and returned me to a theology I found wanting as I grew up with it. I have to forigve them for the idea that reinventing the wheel, for me, was new and exciting. It was not and I lost my heart for it all.

Our forgiving others cannot depend on whether others forgive us first. If that is true, then we are at the mercy of others and probably dead in the water on this topic until others give us permission to forgive and move ahead in life. We can only do our part and we can only do it when we are able and understand deeply the benefit of forgiving to all concerned. That can take time, or not, depending on how willing we are to let it go and get out of the past into a more real and loving present."

That's where I left this topic a few years back. I thought it was about the best answer I could come up to move on.

I think I left out the last stage or perhaps this is the only stage for an open and enlightened mind that really wants to move on and finally answer "how does forgiving or not forgiving serve me?"

Think very carefully on this next sentence...

"Forgiveness, in my experience, happens when the NEED to forgive or be forgiven IS LET GO OF. When we realize that everyone ..EVERYONE...does the best they possibly can under the circumstances of conditioning, there is  no need to forgive or be forgiven.  Forgiveness is THE LETTING GO OF THE NEED TO FORGIVE."  author unknown.

I can't improve on that. Forgiveness is the letting go of the NEED to forgive.  That's it.  If I no longer need to forgive and fighting all the "but they got away with it," or "somehow I don't feel good about forgiving," falls meaningless.  I have been told that forgiveness is not for "them" but for me.  I can go with that, but somehow it never feels like it's over.  Giving up the need to forgive is very liberating. Getting over the idea that someone has to say, "you're right, I was wrong" before I am satisfied, is as well.  Besides, we always suspect people say they are sorry only because they just want us off their backs and don't really mean it or care what you think ultimately.  It simply never seem finished.

I have never heard an Armstrong or a Tkach say, "I'm sorry" about anything.  I cannot live my life waiting for their lights to go on.  I made my choices as well and I have more of a time forgiving myself for being so gullible or stupid or naive than saying I forgive "them."  It is more peaceful to come to the conclusion that I don't even have to struggle with forgiving myself.  I have no need to forgive myself. I was doing the best I could at the time and wild horses could not have taken me out of the church at that time.  Today, that is all over with. 

So perhaps the final stage is losing the very need to forgive.  Stage one is "I'm mad as hell and I'm going to foam out my rage."  Stage Two is "I forgive."  (Most never get this far from what I can see).  and Stage Three may just be, "I don't have a need any longer to forgive."  It was what it was and is what it is and resisiting it all is insanity and hurting my body, mind and spirit. 

I will not give anyone the power run the contents of my mind or emotions again by their actions whether noble or profoundly stupid. I will no longer struggle over finding that forgiving feeling that seems to ellude.

I simple give up the need to forgive .

Forgiveness truly is the letting go of the need to forgive.

Dennis C. Diehl
DenniscDiehl@aol.com

Idiots in the Pulpit: Witches Switchboards Light Up Every Time A Harry Potter Book is Published

It is no wonder people look at Christians and make fun of them when morons like this are sitting there blatantly lying.

Getting Happy-Clappy At The Feast - Or Not?

It's Feast time again and tens of thousands of COG members are gathered together around the world to hear amazing sermons and exquisite music. 

Oh sorry, wrong decade.

Let's start over.

It's Feast time again and 10's of people are gathered at various Festival sites to hear recycled sermons and some half way well done music.

Imagine getting to listen to well trained choirs and voices of superb singers singing songs of praise to God. Well, we all know those days are over.  No mass choirs with orchestra like we had in the Pocono's one year.  No huge choir with a majestic organ like we had in Jekyll Island.

I am sure there are still good singers in the COG who honestly do try their best.  Plus, who cannot help but clap for the kids when they get up and sing!

The WCG and its various harlot daughters over the years have jumped from clapping to no clapping and then back again, over and over.

A report came in to me today that in one area where members were forbidden to to clap for music or sermons.  The reason was:

"There is no clapping at the Feast so no one has pre-eminence above another to lift them up to give them special attention".

That's pretty strange considering how HWA thrived on the clapping.  I remember while at the huge Feast sites in Jekyll Island, Lake of the Ozarks, Pocono's, St Petersburg, etc., clapping like lusty seals the minute HWA or GTA's name was announced.  Men and women wept at the sight of these men mounting the stage.  

 

Being a deacon in Pasadena I remember for years being told that we were to initiate clapping the minute HWA, GTA, or Tkach Sr. came out on stage.  We were to immediately jump to our feet and start clapping.  It was standard practice anywhere HWA went.  His handlers sometimes would prep the sites they were visiting with instructions to make sure people clapped.

Congregations and Feast sites even clapped for his sermons, besides his entrances and exits.

 

Here is a sermon in the 1980's HWA gave where the members sat there clapping when he made one of his bombastic comments:

  This subject is causing a lot of trouble.

 

“Today I would like to speak on what may be the very next attack” on the Church by Satan (ie. preventing interracial marriages from taking place in the Church).

 

‘Satan is going to use interracial marriage as the next attack upon God’s Church’.

 

“If we want to be with God, get on his side. Or get on Satan’s side and go into the lake of fire” with regard to this question.

 

I will not compromise one millionth of an inch on social trends of interracial marriage.

 

Some say we must have racial balance in this world – we will not go the way of Satan!

 

‘But I say that for me and my family, we shall serve the eternal God’ (in relation to interracial marriages). [audience claps loudly in support]The Sin of Interracial Marriage

      

But then as HWA started to age he sat at home more and more and watched services on his TV.  When he started seeing the sheep clapping after sermons by Meredith, Hoeh or Waterhouse, he started to get perturbed.  Clapping was soon banned because these men were starting to get big heads and expected it.  Meredith was could be one grumpy dude when no one clapped after his sermons.

You can go to each of the 600 some splinter groups sites and find 600 some different ways on dealing with clapping. Most do it.

Even the Seventh Day Adventists don't have that much of an issue with it.

    There is no clear evidence that this gesture was part of worship in the Old and New Testaments. In fact, I didn't find the phrase in the entire New Testament. Therefore, there does not seem to be any biblical parallel to what takes place in our churches today.
      You may ask, "Why do we do it?" I'm not sure. I suspect that we incorporated clapping into our services from our cultural environment. Clapping is usually associated with the entertainment industry, but has become very popular in televised evangelical religious services. Perhaps we copied it from them.
      Leaving aside the issue of cultural influence, I suppose that what really matters is that each person be fully aware of the reasons he or she claps in church. Motivation becomes extremely important in this context. Is it an expression of joy in the Lord and His saving power? Is it only a physical expression or a substitute for what used to be the audible amen? Or is it a recognition of the good performance of the singer or the preacher? Adventist Biblical Research

So why does your Feast site allow it and others don't?  Why does your minister tell you not to do it when HWA and others thrived on it and expected it?  

Is he really afraid that when you clap after his sermon that you are actually GLAD he is walking off the stage?

Veggie Tales Feast Presents for the Kiddies

Have you children outgrown Big Beak?  Do you know anyone this would make a good Feast present for? Perhaps Rod Meredith since he seems soooooooooo fascinated by what this represents. Or maybe for Flurry when he starts dating his new bride-to-be who will probably be 30 years younger than him.

How about a REAL Christian product that shows your kids how much you love the Lord.

Talk about failure in product placement!

Rod Meredith Speaks Out Against China

Documented failed prophet Roderick C Meredith has declared that China will not be a superpower in his latest article in the LCG copycat Tomorrow's World magazine.  Of course you can guess who will be.  Wait for it!  It's Lichtenstein!

Oh sorry, wrong Germans.  It's these Germans:

Germany is gearing up to dominate the world once again.  Spanky wants so much to see jackbooted Germans invading this country to spank all the pagans, gays, pig eaters, atheists, agnostics, anti-COGers, etc., etc.  He really gets off on the blood, guts and gore he daydreams about continually.

I hope he realizes that by moving his HQ to North Carolina he has placed his office workers and HQ hanger-on's in the first wave of German U-Boats as they invade the East Coast.  That is, IF,  any of his staff and church members have survived the deadly plagues and famine that will weaken the nation so much that no one will be able to fight the invading Germans.

Of course this also has end-time authority/prophet and world's most distinguished scientist, Dr. Bob Thiel salivating over Spanky's words. While he is off traveling the world and enjoying gastronomic delights during this feast (probably the last one REAL COG members will be able to attend) he is eagerly awaiting his vengeful god to return and wreck havoc on the world he is enjoying so much.

Thiel quotes Spanky:

China will not be the great power of the 21st century. Beset by increasing financial and social problems, Chinese influence will wane and a German-led “European Empire” will surge to the fore in world affairs. (Meredith RC. What is Just Ahead for You? Tomorrow’s World magazine, Sept-Oct 2011, p. 5)

So how does Prophet Thiel know this is true? Because Spanky wrote about this FOUR years ago!  It is prophecy coming alive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Many publications have suggested that the 21st century will be “China’s century.” Even though the Chinese are fiercely moving forward, and their progress in developing their industries is obvious, these publications are dead wrong for two reasons. First, the inspired word of God describes specifically how a coming European Union will be the dominant force in this world—obviously within the next several years. Therefore, brethren, I would like to focus your mind on this matter so you can more intelligently “watch” world events along this line as they unfold before your very eyes. In the coming years, you will perhaps even see a revolt of the peasants in the outlying Chinese cities, who have lagged far behind the standard of living afforded those who have moved to Beijing and Shanghai. Plus, the tremendous pollution of the water, air and foodstuffs may bring about massive disease epidemics and other problems for the Chinese.

In addition, distracting wars and other events may— as God chooses to guide it—greatly undermine the material progress now being made by the Chinese. Meanwhile, you will soon see the European Union evolve into an absolutely powerful and dynamic force in the world— ultimately to become the “Beast” as revealed in Revelation 17 in your own Bible!

So the 21st century will not be the “Chinese century!” Rather it will appear to become the European century for a few years, until the magnificent return of Jesus Christ as King of kings and Lord of lords. From then on, the 21st century will be, indeed, “Christ’s century!” And all of us who are able to understand the “Big Picture” of world events from God’s point of view should be preparing to help straighten out the appalling degree of suffering, starvation and misconduct we find on this earth today in virtually every nation (Meredith R.C. An Inspiring and Successful Trip. Living Church News. May-June 2007, p. 21).

Prophet Thiel ends his blog entry with this firm, authoritative conclusion that is the FINAL word in the matter! Scoffers beware!

The Bible supports what Dr. Meredith has written about China and Europe.  And while China will have some influence this century, it will not truly be its leader.

The Clergy Project

People change as well the information, stories, understandings, so called facts, ideas and truths we all were given from others in our youth.
  

Every wedding I ever performed, whether I thought the couple had much of a chance or not, was an exercise in forcing them to promise they would never change in their views towards life or each other, and then I failed to inform them everything all around them, from this moment on will start to change .  The reason I didn't tell them that was that I did not understand that myself at the time.  You know, "Jesus Christ, the same yesterday, today and tomorrow," along with the church and it's story kind of thing.

Ministry is a somewhat unique calling.  From experience, the membership totally expects the minister to never change and always tell the same old old story they all think they love so well.  They all too often expect him/her to be and do everything they have no personal intention of ever being or doing as well.  I know churches from both sides of the altar so to speak and people are just plain people.  In fact, one lesson from all this myself is that people change very little in life no matter what the story.  

The world of theology is huge. Most in ministry attend the school of their 
denominational choice and, of course, get the spin on the Bible and the "truth" plainly visible to them in their perspectives.  Others outside that experience are less than true.  In most fundamentalist schools it truly becomes a case of "we are right and you are of your father the Devil."  Most liberal seminaries are called liberal because they actually study the bigger picture of theology and admit to it's messy nature. 

But life unfolds. None of us get the truth of anything from birth into it.  It truly is "the glory of a king to search out a matter."  The problem is that as a man or women given to teaching theological truth as they understand it also accumulates more and more knowledge, experience, disasters, pain and life realities along the way. Most of life unfolding will eventually challenge anyone's beliefs so dearly gotten in their youth.  
One reads more and listens to more and eventually comes to hold different conclusions about those once cherished beliefs.  Remember, beliefs are not truth.  There truly are mere beliefs.

And so along with members of churches, ministers realize they need to move on and perhaps either regret the choice in the first place, or at least realize they can't teach what they no longer believe and need out.

Let me be blunt.  On this site and with the experience most here have had, the reactions to or the advice given to such men and women in this life situation are usually along the lines of:

"The bastards should quit now and stop stealing their paychecks"

"The liars deserve what they get."

"The moment you stop believing, you should move out of your house, stop eating the food "they" provide for you by giving you a paycheck, tell your family they can go swim for it and get your job at Walmart you son of a bitch."

I can't help you if that's the best you can come up with in your mind on how a man or woman who probably made a lot of personal sacrifices and has a story on how they came to ministry themselves, should handle this dilemma in their maturing lives.  However, I do expect these kinds of comments and will attribute them to painbodies trying to get even  :)  I know many CURRENT COG minister and member types who struggle with this dilemma and stay.  I know many COG members who "keep the Feast," by going to nice places each Fall but never to any services.  Yet they painly tell their friends and bosses, "I have to keep the Feast."

For decades, ministers have told me, "You are ahead of your time and you say what I only think!"   I can't help that but do know the conflict of it all.  I imagine most critical thinking Christians of all denominations understand this concept. 

The Clergy project, sponsored by the Freedom From Religion is an organization that helps clergy, most highly educated at the best schools and not booklet educated Apostles, Watchers and Witnesses, is the work of Dan Barker, former Evangelical Pastor and Author of Losing Faith in Faith.    Most of these pastors could tie the average person up in knots of the history of the Bible and the contradictory messages it contains.  The Clergy Project is a compassionate and balanced way for men and women of former faith to move on with as little collateral damage as possible.  Many times the damage is unavoidable and the lives of mates, children and extended are forever changed as well.  

I serve in the capacity of "one who knows'' to this project and find it all very familiar with only the names and organizations changing.  

Life is a journey and the Clergy Project is a way station along the way for men and women of former faith who finally had to face the facts and stop not seeing what they do see.  It's a painful journey and like a church member who can just not choose to show up the next week while their lives keep in full step, liberating sometime after the "No one told me this when I was in Seminary" hits the fan. 

The Clergy project is a very compassionate, balanced and extremely helpful endeavor and I honor them in this. I am pleased to be a small part of it. I wish I had had something like this in my own transitions instead of just getting thrown under the bus by my own studies and denomination and left in the gutter with, "just call the business office and they can help you with your questions about severance," or as the head of the WCG "Reconciliation Dept" said,  "We wish you the best of luck and will pray for you."   Or did they say "be warmed and be filled,"   I forget...

The Clergy Project

The Clergy Project is a confidential online community for active and former clergy who do not hold the supernatural beliefs of their religious traditions. The Clergy Project launched on March 21st, 2011. 

Currently, the community's nearly 100 members use it to network and discuss what it's like being an unbelieving leader in a religious community. The Clergy Project’s goal is to support members as they move beyond faith. Members freely discuss issues related to their transition from believer to unbeliever including:

• Wrestling with intellectual, ethical, philosophical and theological issues
• Coping with cognitive dissonance
• Addressing feelings of being stuck and fearing the future
• Looking for new careers
• Telling their families
• Sharing useful resources
• Living as a nonbeliever with religious spouses and family
• Using humor to soften the pain
• Finding a way out of the ministry
• Adjusting to life after the ministry

“We know there must be thousands of clergy out there who have secretly abandoned their faith but have nowhere to turn,” says Dan Barker, a former evangelical preacher who “lost faith in faith” after 19 years of preaching the gospel. “Now they do have a place to meet, a true sanctuary, a congregation of those of us who have replaced faith and dogma with reason and human well-being.” 

Dennis C. Diehl

DenniscDiehl@aol.com