Tuesday, June 30, 2020

Gerald Weston: Beware of Fake News



It was kind of funny reading how Gerald Weston wants us to beware of fake news. Remember, this is coming from Living Church of God..need I say more?

We hear a great deal about fake news these days and there is no lack of it coming from all quarters, as objectivity is sorely lacking in politics, academia, media, and popular culture. However, there is also much misinformation regarding God’s plan and how He is working it out. The doctrines of Jesus and first-century Christianity have been drastically altered, watered down, and infused with pagan philosophy and religion. You likely understand this, being readers of Tomorrow’s World and viewers of our television program. Our booklets point out biblical truths that you never hear in most churches, where greater emphasis is placed on “feel good” gospels rather than straight-talk messages from the Bible about the need to change and become conformed to the Jesus Christ of the Bible.

Look at the decades of misinformation that has streamed out of the church, doctrinally and spiritually. Weston is in no position to warn us about misinformation, particularly when it comes to religion. Living Church of God does NOT follow first-century Christianity.  That is a totally impossible thing for any of today's groups to do.  It doesn't matter how much they claim to.

LCG's booklets do not steer people to the truth but to legalistic mumbo-jumbo that is not required of new covenant Christians. The so-called "straight talk" is devoid of anything about grace, mercy, and justice, all things Jesus talked about and accomplished.

Paul’s rebuke of the Corinthians is as relevant today as it was in the first century: “For if he who comes preaches another Jesus whom we have not preached, or if you receive a different spirit which you have not received, or a different gospel which you have not accepted—you may well put up with it” (2 Corinthians 11:4). Paul explained later in this same chapter about those preachers who bring a different Jesus, a different spirit, and a different gospel: “For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into apostles of Christ. And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into minister of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works” (vv. 13-15).

Paul's rebuke of the Corinthians is certainly relevant today when it perfectly describes the hundreds of splinter groups all doing what they want and not being followers of the Word. 

Of the five things listed below they have zeroed in on one of them...REBUKE. LCG has a sad reputation of using this to the extreme, though rather selectively depending upon who you are. Rod Meredith was heavy-handed at this down through his slash and burn periods when he was over Church Administration and then as leader of two separate splinter groups. Long-suffering has never been quality that LCG and its leaders practiced, but then neither did Herbert Armstrong and the Worldwide Church of God.

No, the problem was not for that day alone. The Bible prophesied this would be an issue for our day as well. Paul instructed the young evangelist Timothy, “Preach the word! Be ready in season and out of season. Convince, rebuke, exhort, with all longsuffering and teaching. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables” (2 Timothy 4:2-4).

And the prophet Isaiah was instructed to take God’s warning and to “write it before them on a tablet, and note it on a scroll, that it may be for time to come, forever and ever: That this is a rebellious people, lying children, children who will not hear the law of the Lord; who say to the seers, ‘Do not see,’ and to the prophets, ‘Do not prophesy to us right things; speak to us smooth things, prophesy deceits. Get out of the way, turn aside from the path, cause the Holy One of Israel to cease from before us’” (Isaiah 30:8-11). 

And here we go again, sex. Is there any topic that fascinates LCG leaders more than sex? 

It has never been popular to teach the true Gospel of Jesus Christ and to warn this world of what is to come if we do not turn around and go a different direction, but it is shocking how rapidly censorship of non-politically correct ideas is descending on our Western world. Truth is suppressed, while every kind of sexual filth and violence is promoted. You would be surprised how often one of our television programs is rejected by a station or governing authority because it does not fit the politically correct narrative.

Ah, the other favorite topic of Weston and select COG leaders...we are being persecuted. These sad boys have no idea what persecution is. Having an asinine broadcast or article rejected is not persecution. Real Christians around the world face persecution every day from Muslims, Hindus, and others. They are dying for their belief while Weston, Theil, and the rest of the boys go home every night to their nice homes, feed their faces, drink their wine, and play on their computers. Persecution has never been so horrible!

Paul instructed Timothy regarding “the last days” and how they would be marked by danger, as “men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control. . .” (2 Timothy 3:2-5). Danger may come in many different forms and include physical injury or death, but what about the danger we see today of someone losing a job for tweeting a comment that does not fit the agenda of today’s “social engineers”? 

This is the world in which we are to preach the truth unapologetically, and God tells us through the prophet Ezekiel that we will be held accountable if we fail to do so (Ezekiel 33:1-7). Even the Proverbs warn us that we will have to answer to God if we hold back from warning the world of where it is heading: “Deliver those who are drawn toward death, and hold back those stumbling to the slaughter. If you say, ‘Surely we did not know this,’ does not He who weighs the hearts consider it? He who keeps your soul, does He not know it? And will He not render to each man according to his deeds?” (Proverbs 24:11-12).

LCG and the mother church never preached the truth unapologetically. From Herbert's, "A strong hand from someplace" tot he wishy-washy sermons and mind-numbing cable programs, LCFG and most of the COG's are like kindergarteners playing on a playground spinning the merry-go-round as fast as they can to see who they can throw off.

Dear brethren and co-workers, we have a job to do. We are faithfully doing it and your prayers make a difference. When we receive an unexpected tithe from someone who is not even a subscriber, or an inheritance from someone we don’t even know, we recognize that God is blessing us and answering the prayers of His faithful people. Frankly, those of us here in Charlotte and in our offices around the world have been humbled at how our Creator has blessed us during this difficult economic time. I cannot thank you enough for your generosity and for your heartfelt prayers. Please remember to give thanks for the way God is blessing His Work, and for the blessings He pours out on each of us individually.

Sincerely, in Christ’s service,
Gerald E. Weston

Always end your letter with a money appeal. While you lazy and unappreciative brethren fail to send in money, we want you to know that random people send us money all the time. Even more amazing is random people sending us tithe money! Woo Hoo! Now get off your butts and send us your money, too!




62 comments:

TLA said...

Maybe Jerry should have ended with the appeal to watch their program on July 28th - "The end of America". The future is dire.

Of course, the problem is, if you believe this, then which one of the 500 true churches do you join?

Anonymous said...

Someone posting in another thread reported that LCG's very talented Music Director, Marcus McCullough, had been suspended and then left LCG. Is this fake news, or can someone here confirm any details?

Anonymous said...

LCG is always making the fake claim of following original Christianity, yet they do not preach or understand any of the terms of the New Covenant. The New Covenant is not like the obsolete Old Covenant (Hebrews 8:7-9).

Those Jews who became the original Christians were extremely excited about, and risked their lives for, the terms of the New Covenant. Saul, before he became Paul, was alarmed and disgusted about the New Covenant. Faker Weston, and his LCG have a very long documented history of not caring enough about the New Covenant to write a booklet, sermon, or telecast about the New Covenant. Their loose grasp on the Old Covenant is more captivating to them than Jesus and the message of the cross.

The long-documented history of the LCG Fakers has law and government as their supreme interest. Colossians 1:15-19 preaches the supremacy of Jesus; verse 20 preaches a gospel of reconciliation, which is very foreign to LCG: "and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross." Paul concludes by saying this is the Gospel he committed his life to.
Instead of the biblical terms of Jesus redeeming, reconciling, and justifying - the LGG Fakers preach justification by law. Therefore, LCG is the has been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace (Galatians 5:4).

The deceiving Weston mentioned the preaching of another Jesus cited in 2 Corinthians 11:4. LCG is so alienated from Jesus, they barely mention Him - when they do mention Jesus it is not in reference to Savior Jesus - because LCG teaches that works are what saves you.

Weston actually wrote: "It has never been popular to teach the true Gospel of Jesus Christ and to warn this world of what is to come if we do not turn around and go a different direction …" Weston's fake gospel is a warning to turn around and go a different direction. The fakers ignore all the references to the real Gospel that offers salvation through Jesus (Romans 10:9, Col 1:21-29, Acts 15:11, Acts 16:31, 2 Timothy 1:9).

Don't send your money to the LCG Fakers! Instead seek the riches of God's grace, available through the redemptive work of Jesus.

Ephesians 1:7
In him we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, in accordance with the riches of God’s grace.

the Ocelot said...

And let us not forget about the "two trees" A classic!

Unknown said...

What is required to be a new covenant Christian?

Anonymous said...

Weston realizes that there is no power over another human being in the New Covenant. The New Covenant does not threaten you with death if you disobey a ritual, a holy day is missed, because all those were just a shadow. There is fear in the OT, yes indeed, hence that is why these nasty cults teach so much from the OT. Its a cash machine. Treat every member like their a ATM machine.

Anonymous said...

@June 30, 2020 at 7:25 PM


Spoken like a true protestant.




"What is required to be a new covenant Christian?

June 30, 2020 at 9:33 PM"

According to nominal Christianity, just walk down the aisle, say "I repent", get dunked or sprinkled, then you are free to do anything you please because you're "saved".

Anonymous said...

A New Covenant Christian is someone who accepts Jesus as the Savior who gives the GIFT of salvation and righteousness through grace. Here are a few verses:

2 Timothy 1:10
it has now been revealed through the appearing of our Savior, Christ Jesus, who has destroyed death and has brought life and immortality to light through the gospel.

Acts 15:11
We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”

Ephesians 2:5
made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved.

Ephesians 2:8
For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—

2 Timothy 1:9
He has saved us and called us to a holy life—not because of anything we have done but because of his own purpose and grace.

Anonymous said...

legalistic mumbo-jumbo that is not required of new covenant Christians

Okay, I think HWA and his crowd twist things around and anti-COG sites keep judging them against the New Covenant. But nobody ever quotes scripture that defines the terms of your so-called "New Covenant". Is it the one stated in Jerimiah 31? Bob Thiel says the Laws are written on his heart, so what he decides what his heart says. His CCOG must be Israel then or Judah. A televangelist Andy Stanley says the New Covenant is defined by John 13 "Love one another" and that's it. Another pastor said when Jesus said "It is finished" He abolished the Law except for the 10 Commandments and some things Paul said about gays and women. The CEM book Law and Covenant seems clear but leaves too many loose ends. So how bout it, this New Covenant you judge everyone against, where are the terms of it given???

As Unknown 9:33 asked, What is required to be a new covenant Christian?

No mumbo-jumbo please.

Anonymous said...

When Weston cries "FAKE NEWS" we can be sure people have been telling the truth about LCG.

Anonymous said...

What is required to be a new covenant Christian?

What is required to be a Philadelphia Christian? Depends on which COG you are talking about.

TLA said...

From LCG's latest commentary:
A House Divided Cannot Stand

Is this hypocrisy, satire, or just plain stupid?

1 Corinthians 12:25
“That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another.”

The COGS are split into 500 schisms - truly a house divided - makes our current state of the nation look united by comparison.

If the COGs were divided like our nation, there would only be 2 big splinters and a few house groups.

LCG, and all the other splinters - take the beam out of your own eyes, before trying to remove the specks in our nation's eyes.

Anonymous said...

"The doctrines of Jesus and first-century Christianity have been drastically altered . . ."

I am wondering what the LCG believes the first-century doctrines are. Somehow I have a feeling that the first-century doctrines for them are defined this way:

- Whatever Herman Hoeh decided to filter from the Old Testament into the New Testament for observance by the WCG. (Hoeh published an article on this and I believe it appeared in The Good News magazine back in the Fifties of Sixties.)

That view, then, raises the question of epistemology. How is Herman Hoeh knowledgeable about what the first century Jewish Christians observed and practiced that permitted him to do this filtration. A time-machine?

The next issue is profound. What I have read is that the 1st century Jewish Christians essentially continued to observe the Torah with the addition of the new understanding that Christ is the Messiah. But the status of their observation of the Torah was apparently cultural. Paul, in his statement after the Jerusalem Conference, did not transfer any of the cultural content of Torah observance, including the Sabbath, to Gentile Christians.

This is and old issue. Armstrongism argues erroneously that there are only two moments of law - the Torah and the results of the Jerusalem conference. They exclude the Sermon on the Mount as a statement of moral code at the same level of these two moments, hence, denying Christ and the over-arching significance of his words. From this they conclude the Jerusalem Conference results were incomplete because they did not include, for instance, a prohibition against stealing and, therefore, one must derive this from the Torah. This is all concocted to justify the carrying forward of Sabbath observance from the Old Testament.

The "kiss of death" is that Armstrongism then elevates the pieces of the Torah that Hoeh carried over to the level of requirements for salvation. In other words, they have added extraneous requirements to the New Covenant requirements for salvation. This is why Armstrongism is a Jesus Plus cult - Jesus plus denominational requirements are necessary for salvation. This is all in clear contravention to Paul who did not carry forward the bulk of the Torah when he had the perfect opportunity to at the Jerusalem Conference. Armstrongism is not first-century Christianity. It is twentieth-century religious philosophy brewed up by HWA and Herman Hoeh.

My two cents . . .


Anonymous said...

What are the "terms" of the New Covenant? Where can I find a list of "terms" in the bible?

Anonymous said...

Anonymous Anonymous said...
Someone posting in another thread reported that LCG's very talented Music Director, Marcus McCullough, had been suspended and then left LCG. Is this fake news, or can someone here confirm any details?

It's not fake news. He was suspended, which is a nice way of saying GET OUT, we don't want you around anymore.

It's a church so full of love. Did you happen to see the Weston video in which they ordained Mario Hernandez an evangelist, BUT not before bashed him twice. All in love of course...let me bring out two of your faults as a person. Then to stick the knife in a bit more, he said they were going to ordain him months ago, but forgot. Ouch. Such love.

TLA said...

Marcus McCullough - if are reading this - I hope you find (or have found) a job where they appreciate the joy, passion, and skill you bring to music performances.

LCG - you are really, really bad at music. If this is the best that you can do, then I recommend you give it up entirely. You are like the tone deaf contest on American Idol who does not know how truly awful they are.

Anonymous said...

Where can I find a list of "terms" in the bible?

For terms the "Old" Covenant, try Exodus and Deuteronomy. For the Laws that are attached to the Covenant, they are spread from Genesis to Deuteronomy. For the terms of the "New" Covenant in the "New Testament" you can look from Matthew to Revelation and not find any.

Anonymous said...

The purpose of the New Covenant was to forgive sins, not establish "terms"!

Anonymous said...

According to nominal Christianity, just walk down the aisle, say "I repent", get dunked or sprinkled, then you are free to do anything you please because you're "saved".

July 1, 2020 at 4:17 AM
-------------------------------------

Not if God can see the heart. He's like Santa, he see's if you bullshitting him or are sincere. I guess you don't believe your bible but do believe Herbie.

Anonymous said...

The purpose of the New Covenant was to forgive sins, not establish "terms"!

Sorry, you forgot to give the Bible verse where that appears.

A Covenant is an agreement between two parties. God and Israel were the two parties that agreed to the terms God proposed. Where was that mutual agreement made so the two parties commenced the New Covenant? And remember Paul stated in Galatians 3:17 that a New Covenant doesn't nullify an existing covenant.
According to Jer. 31, the New Covenant is still in the future, despite what Bob Thiel said.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous (11:39) "For the terms of the "New" Covenant in the "New Testament" you can look from Matthew to Revelation and not find any."

That is a stunning statement. How do you define terms? You must be using an atypical definition. The Beatitudes in Matthew 5 are a set of terms well known to all Christians. There are terms defining what constitutes salvation. I am not sure what is behind your assertion.

Anonymous said...

The Old Covenant (and other religions) can be summarized by the word "DO" the New Covenant can be encapsulated by the word "DONE"!

The New Covenant is all about what Jesus has done - as Savior, he has already done everything one needs to be saved. We can do nothing to earn salvation - it's a gift from God.

One of the "terms" of the New Covenant is Justification.

Humans are not righteous; we're sinners - we all have bad thoughts, do mean things, neglect to help when we see a need, take more than our share, etc.

A Christian could never be righteous enough on his own, by his own works. Jesus is completely righteous. Justification is the "term" that is biblically described as Jesus' righteousness is given to a Christian so that the Christian is completely righteous in the sight of God.

To enter the Kingdom of God, one needs to be one hundred percent righteous. The Christian is one hundred percent righteous - only because he has been justified by the perfect righteousness of Jesus.

Anonymous said...

Grace is another biblical "term" essential to the New Covenant.

Grace is the gift of God that forgives us from sin.

We all do bad stuff and do not deserve anything but a bad outcome for that bad stuff we do.

Grace is unmerited forgiveness for our sin and the good outcome of eternal salvation.

Grace is a display of God’s love.

Grace is saving, sanctifying, healing, empowering, relational, pursuing, eternal, irresistible, regenerative, a never-ending supply of sufficiency for whatever you need, sufficient for whatever ails you, divine blessing that goes beyond mercy, benevolence, etc.

Grace is amazing - I could go on forever about grace.
Since we are saved by grace, don’t waste your time in a church that doesn't care much for discussing grace - or any of the other "terms" of the New Covenant.

You cannot find any of the descriptions I've used above to define the "terms" central to the New Covenant in COG sermons or publications. However, you can look up Holy Scriptures that depict these terms by using a Bible search tool, such as https://www.biblegateway.com/

Anonymous said...

The Old Covenant is obsolete, outdated.
It was replaced by a new, superior covenant, that is not like the old covenant.
The Old Covenant was between God and Israel.
The New Covenant is available to all people.
The Book of Hebrews discusses the difference between the two covenants.

Anonymous said...

The COGs insist that they have superior knowledge of the Kingdom of God.

COGs will site Matthew 6:33 "But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well."

They do seem to be earnestly seeking the Kingdom, as far as they understand it. However, they get tripped up by the second half of the verse because they are seeking their own righteousness.

Unfortunately, their own righteousness has never taken them very far.


Galatians 3:11
Clearly no one who relies on the law is justified before God, because “the righteous will live by faith.”

Romans 3:25-27
"God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the shedding of his blood—to be received by faith. He did this to demonstrate his righteousness, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished— he did it to demonstrate his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus.
Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. Because of what law? The law that requires works? No, because of the law that requires faith."

The COGs think they also have superior knowledge of the law. They have a loose grasp on the "law that requires works" presented in the Old Covenant. However, the COGs no nothing that about the New Covenant "law that requires faith".

Unfortunately, all of the lovely COG members who are sincerely seeking the Kingdom of God are being misled by false ministers who cannot teach them how to get there.

Anonymous said...

Coarse language Mr Armstrong.

Anonymous said...

If the laws are obsolete then what about laws on marriage? Or do you cherry pick the laws you like.

nck said...

11:57

What about the "laws" of marriage?

The prime directive is, Man gets to play boss, woman is the boss. Only in times of war woman defers........ until most men have "suicided" themselves for the honor thing. Then woman gets a new chance to raise a new generation of little men into some great some little.

Nck

Anonymous said...

Hey Anonymous of July 1 at 11:57 PM,
To answer your question:
Hebrews 8:13
By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear.

The Old Covenant is obsolete. Jesus is the fulfilment of the law. Love is the fulfilment of the Law. Laws still exists. You cannot gain salvation by law-keeping.

It may sound confusing but you can find the Scriptures to support the statements I wrote above. However, COG ministers are not able to shed any light on law under the New Covenant.

Luke 20:46
“Beware of the teachers of the law.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous (11:57) wrote: "Or do you cherry pick the laws you like."

The OT laws governing marriage have been abrogated. This does not do away with the human institution of marriage itself, just a particular type of governance. Because the dietary laws in Leviticus have been abrogated, for example, it does not mean you should discontinue eating.

Armstrongists did, in fact, "cherry pick" the Torah to create a third religion, outside of Judaism and Christianity, that is an amalgam of parts of the OT and parts of the NT. This was done principally by HWA and Herman Hoeh. If you let the Sabbath through the gate into New Testament territory, the gate just may be left open for Torahic requirements to enter. Armstrong and Hoeh determined what laws were to be carried forward. Paul contested this open gate vehemently as it relates to circumcision. The Sabbath is to Armstrongism what circumcision was to the first century Galationists.

But Armstrong and Hoeh did not fully accept what they adopted from the Old Testament either. They also believed that the OT laws were done away in practice if not in theory. They invoked Administrative Governance to alter these migrated Torahic laws. That is why their people stay in hotels at Sukkoth rather than a brush arbor as the Torah requires. That is why they do not carry a little paddle with them so that they can dig a hole in the ground to defecate into. Such modifications are under the umbrella of Armstrongist administrative policy.

So Christians recognized the abrogation of the OT and its replacement by the Sermon on the Mount and other moral content in the NT. Armstrongists cherry picked the OT and altered compliance administratively. In either case, the OT as an integrated system was superseded.

Anonymous said...

To 5:20 pm

You really need to learn your bible.

The New Covenant is not "still in the future"!

Mat 26:28 - For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.


By the way, that's the scripture that proves my statement that the New Covenant was to forgive sins, not to establish "terms"!

Anonymous said...

NEO, where did Jesus say, "If you keep the B attitudes then I will forgive your sins"?

The B attitudes are not "terms" of the New Covenant!

If the New Covenant has "terms" which must be obeyed, then the first time you break one term you've broken the Covenant.

That is why the New Covenant has no terms, no laws, God however has terms, has laws. It takes intelligence to understand that. God is much more than the Covenant.

Anonymous said...

Anon 4:54 and others

Context, context, context!

Hebrews 8:13 is preceded by a discussion of the New Covenant with Israel and Judah from Jeremiah 31! That covenant is in the future, as the conditions it describes are not yet evident. And Paul wrote in Galatians 3 that a new covenant doesn't nullify an old one, add to it or take away from it without mutual agreement. And Israel and Judah are not labels for "The Church". Paul in Romans makes it clear that Gentiles are grafted in to Israel, into Hebraic Roots. Jesus alluded to the New Covenant in His last passover, but didn't establish it. Without "terms" there is nothing to bind a covenant. The Law itself is not the Covenant.

People who want do away with God-given commandments are just trying to bring God down to man's level and honor Him on their own terms, not His...

Anonymous said...

"And Paul wrote in Galatians 3 that a new covenant doesn't nullify an old one,"


What????? Is that what you've learned from your Hebrew Roots teachers? Utter ignorance. Paul said that you can't add to an already ratified covenant, he didn't say that a New Covenant couldn't nullify an Old Covenant. He plainly said the Law (Old Covenant) was only till the Seed came.

"Jesus alluded to the New Covenant in His last passover, but didn't establish it."


Another ignorant Hebrew Roots teaching. Jesus certainly did establish the New Testament (Covenant) in His blood. See Matt. 26:28

And before you claim that I am against God's law, I have kept the Sabbath and feasts for over 50 years. Not, however, because the Old Covenant commands them.

Get away from the Hebrew Roots movement, they haven't a clue about the bible!

Anonymous said...

Anon (8:56)

You need to give us a comprehensive definition of what you mean by "terms". And then explain why you seem to have narrowed the definition.

The following is a term in the agreement:

"Blessed are the poor in spirit,
for theirs is the kingdom of heaven."

This is a covenant obligation stated in conditional form. If Christ were not to honor this term, the Covenant would by violated.

Maybe you can try again to explain what you are trying to assert.

Anonymous said...

Terms

Sorry but I thought terms of an agreement were something people knew about. Simply they are "you do this" and "I'll do this", for example, God to Abraham - he was to be circumcised; God agreed to make Abraham a great nation. For Israel's covenant, the Shema is probably the easiest collection of terms to understand - Deut 6:5-9, 11:13-31, and Numb 15:37-41.

Anonymous said...

Jesus and his death on the cross mean very little to the deceitful COG ministers like Westona and Winnail.

The history of what the COGs teach is well documented - it is overwhelmingly about law, with just a little Jesus sprinkled in.

Keeping the law cannot make a COGer right with God (justified is made right) - yet law is what the COGers are fascinated with.

Galatians 2:15-16 “We who are Jews by birth and not sinful Gentiles 16 know that a person is not justified by the works of the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in[d] Christ and not by the works of the law, because by the works of the law no one will be justified.

Fake ministers like Weston and Winnail teach people to put their faith in law keeping while ignoring faith in Jesus as Savior.

The fakers set aside the grace of God - they never preach about it and instead teach that law keeping makes people righteous – they don’t value what Jesus did through his death and would never tell their people the Jesus loves them and died so that they can live.

Galatians 2:19-21 “For through the law I died to the law so that I might live for God. I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!”

If you are interested in salvation, DO NOT follow fake ministers who don't mention the grace of God, those who teach righteousness can be gained through the law, and those who do not know or teach Jesus as Savior!

Anonymous said...

Ephesians 2:8-9
For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast.

Before you pay another tithe, weigh what your church teaches.

If your church is very heavy on works/law and very light on Grace and God's gift - you should know, by Ephesians 2:8-9, something is very wrong with your church -they can't teach you how to be saved.

If your church teaches you must work for God's gift of salvation - that church doesn't understand what a gift is and therefore won't be able to preach the Gospel with your tithe.

Anonymous said...

What happened to Jesus' foreskin?

Unless Jesus' body never underwent "decay" during his lifetime he could not be God, but if it did not undergo "decay" then he was not truly human.

Anonymous said...

????????

nck said...

12:05
It is my sociological informed opinion that your harping on Jesus' foreskin has a direct effect on the name of the Redskins.

Nck

Anonymous said...

works/law and very light on Grace

God to Adam: And the day you eat of that tree you will surely die.
Adam: So, it's all about law is it?

Jesus: A new commandment I give you...
Disciples: Again with laws! Oi vey!

Anonymous said...

"Not if God can see the heart. He's like Santa, he see's if you bullshitting him or are sincere. I guess you don't believe your bible but do believe Herbie.

July 1, 2020 at 4:33 PM"



So you're saying there are limits on behavior? That some sort of action is required on the part of the believer? Like, maybe, following God's instructions? Obeying His law?

Anonymous said...

"People who want do away with God-given commandments are just trying to bring God down to man's level and honor Him on their own terms, not His...

July 2, 2020 at 11:32 AM"




Yes, which makes them "God" and not Him.

Anonymous said...

12:05 AM
The way I see it re Christ’s circumcision it would’ve been a fraction of His foreskin that would’ve been cut that lay beyond the tip of His meatus. It definitely would not have been the excessive and mutilating form of Talmudic or American circumcision that is standard practice today and involves the entire removal of the foreskin.
Also, I believe once removed from His body it would’ve decayed just like any strands of His hair from his head or beard that would’ve fallen out or been trimmed off; and likewise any skin cells that would’ve been shed from His body; and even any semen that He would’ve ejaculated naturally during nocturnal emissions.

Anonymous said...

Anon 12:05 seems not to understand that the ACOGs teach that Jesus didn't have two natures when he was human.

With that in mind, have you ever seen a three day old dead body? Once rigor mortis has set in, it would be incredibly painful to become reanimated in that body, as the ACOGs claim Jesus was. Yet we don't read of Jesus suffering terrible pain before His ascension into Heaven. What's up with that?

Anonymous said...

Anonymous (6:33)

I did not expect that you would have such a simple definition of the concept "terms". Now I am puzzled why you cannot see such mutual agreements throughout the New Covenant. I would ask for further explanation but I will not be looking at this post again.

Anonymous said...

8:56 was my post, 6:33 was not.

If you're unable to understand that God requires terms or command or laws even outside of covenants then no matter how much I explain it'll do no good.

Does a parent have to make a contract with their kid before expecting obedience? God expects obedience, covenants are completely outside that expectation.

The B attitudes are things that God expects, the New Covenant doesn't require them, God does.

Again, the New Covenants sole purpose is to forgive sins, to forgive broken "terms". It's purpose was not to give another/a different list of terms or laws. God has had specific terms/laws that he's expected freezer m creation. Simply reading the bible will reveal what they are.

The New Covenant has no terms/laws other than having faith in Christ. That's it! Then he promises to forgive the sins of those who accept the covenant.

That doesn't mean that God doesn't still expect his terms/laws to be obeyed.

It's easy to understand if you all quit complicating it.

Anonymous said...

In Exodus, Moses mediated the Sinai Covenant with Israel - God said what He required, and Israel agreed. In Deuteronomy, the Covenant was agreed again. When did Israel/Judah agree to the New Covenant? Was it the Covenant of Jeremiah 31? If so, are the Laws written on your heart? Does everyone "know the Lord" now?

nck said...

5:53
WCG did not teach Jesus resurection in the flesh. Indeed it was taught Jesus was fully hunan before his death, albeit bequethef with a full portion of "The Force" aka the Holy spirit.

Nck

nck said...

I also belief that this discussion is irrelevant without a proper knowledge of Roman Law.

There are several types of contract.

Some imply that previous customs are aplicable and the terms stipulate "good stewardship of the same."

Nck

Anonymous said...

Hmm, interesting thread. I remember way back I asked a question regarding the critique made about COG practices and denouncing them with the magic words, "New Covenant". I remember asking if the comparison could be a bit more specific, like what particular aspect of the NC was being violated. I only got a wild speculation as a response.
I told a pastor that some Biblical terms take on a life of their own, like Baptism (rather than immersion). I think with some the words "New Covenant" turned into a magic wand to make things one doesn't accept go away.
Hope someone gives a good answer to the off-topic questions in this thread.

Anonymous said...

Can a man’s death end a covenant made by God?

Can a man make a covenant as if God made it?

Anonymous said...

Someone said the purpose of the New Covenant was to forgive sin.
I agree with that completely.

Colossians 2:13-15
When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins, 14 having canceled the charge of our legal indebtedness, which stood against us and condemned us; he has taken it away, nailing it to the cross. And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross.

But, also I believe that justification and grace goes beyond that – by the making of relationship between God and man possible – thereby, the New Covenant brings eternal life and glory.

2 Corinthians 3:6–11
He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was, will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? If the ministry that brought condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness! For what was glorious has no glory now in comparison with the surpassing glory. And if what was transitory came with glory, how much greater is the glory of that which lasts!

Anonymous said...

Anonymous of July 3, 2020 at 5:07 AM said:
"People who want do away with God-given commandments are just trying to bring God down to man's level and honor Him on their own terms, not His...
Yes, which makes them "God" and not Him.

The COGs have never understood what God commanded.

They have a history of following some laws, ignoring others, and modifying some laws to their liking. You can take the FOT as an example.

Make three columns - one for Follow, one for Ignore, and the third for Modify. Then read all the instructions regarding keeping the FOT in the Bible. As you read each command, add it to the appropriate column that coincides with your COG's history of practice.

Under the New Covenant, God expects obedience. However, the GOGs are lost here too.

Before worrying about others supposedly trying to abolish God-given commands, study what the Bible says about justification, grace, salvation, redemption, the cross, and Jesus as Savior.

That's what is so frustrating about COGers - they wrongly claim to know what others believe and are so condemning of others. However, the COGer's ignorance of the Bible is always on display - and they will never directly address the biblical terms that are so beautiful to those Christians who the GOGers condemn as being blasphemous heathens.

Anonymous said...

I remember a family gathering about ten years ago at which I was discussing "justification" with one relative. Another relative, a member of LCG, overheard us and said, "Where'd you get that nonsense from?" In unison, we turned to him and answered, "The Bible!"

The LCG member wasn't aware what the concept of justification is or that it could be found in the Bible. After some discussion and showing Scripture, the LCG member acknowledges that the term justification is in the Bible. However, it is very sad that he does not care to know anything about it - but, law really excites him. You can try to discuss grace or Savior Jesus with him, and he will bring the discussion back to law.

This LCG member is completely sold on the idea that if LCG is not preaching about it, it is not important. He thinks giving large amounts of money to LCG, keeping the LCG version of the law, and obeying the government of LCG is all he needs to do to "make it into the Kingdom". He stubbornly doesn't want to hear anything the Bible has to say about being saved by grace, not law.

It's very sad that so many are brainwashed, but Herbie was right about one thing – he often repeated, "The deceived don't know they are deceived."

Anonymous said...

Why are you frustrated that COGers don't do as you wish ? You are free to live as you wish but they are not.

Hoss said...

Anon 802 commented The COGs have never understood what God commanded.

Great idea for analyzing the COG take on commands. HWA's approach seemed to be that commands had to "make sense" to him - so t'hara and t'mah (clean/unclean) must mean healthy/unhealthy.
The Hebrew rendering of commands are mishpatim (which seem to "make sense") chokim (? why do we need to do that?) and mitzvot (well, yeah, I think I can see that...)

Perhaps another analysis of COG commands is the "seriousness" - again, columns, and here "Must keep" (no choice or Lake of Fire - like tithing!) "Should keep" (okay, some leeway) "don't need to keep" (but you can if you like) and "Mustn't keep" (No! You deny the "work of Christ" if you keep these!)

Anonymous said...

Weston shouldn't be worried about fake news leaking out from Charlotte about LCG....when an employee is "dismissed", they force them to sign a non disclosure agreement. My guess is if you don't sign the agreement then they have leverage over you to disfellowhip you. So, you probably won't hear a word about what happened to Marcus. Of course, LCG will just say this is fake news.

Anonymous said...

Since this thread is about Fake News, we might as well discuss whether Jesus was God or not. Not all Christians believe he was God.

What do the gospel accounts claim he said regarding this …

Matthew 19:17a So he said to him, “Why do you call me good? No one is good but One, that is, God.”
Luke 18:19a So Jesus said to him, “Why do you call me good? No one is good but One, that is, God.”
Mark 10:18 So Jesus said to him, “Why do you call me good? No one is good but One, that is, God.”
Mark 12:29 Jesus answered him, “The first of all the commandments is: ‘Hear, O Israel, YHVH our God, YHVH is one.”

The saying did not originate from him. He was merely quoting Deu 6:4. Neither is the second commandment. He was quoting Lev 19:18b.

John 5:44 “How can you believe, who receive honor from one another, and do not seek the honor that comes from THE ONLY GOD? “
John 17:1-3 Jesus spoke these words, lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said: “FATHER, … And this is eternal life, that they may know YOU, THE ONLY TRUE GOD, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.”

John uses the Greek word ‘monos’ for the English word ‘only’. The above verses show Jesus believed there is only one God. He did not accept the compliment ‘good’ as he believed only God can be called good.


What about after death?

John 20:17 Jesus said to her, “Do not cling to me, for I have not yet ascended to my Father; but go to my brethren and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, and to my God and your God.’ ”

Rev 3:2 Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die, for I have not found your works perfect before God.

Why did Jesus not consider himself God? In Rev 3:12, why did the heavenly Jesus kept on saying ‘my God’ if he was God?


How about the apostles?

1 Cor 8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for Him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and through whom we live.

Eph 4:4-6 There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called in one hope of your calling; one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

Paul believed there is only one God, the one we call Father. He used the Greek word ’theos’. He addressed Jesus as lord from the Greek ‘kurios’ meaning lord or master. In his epistles, he identified God as the Father and distinguished God from Jesus. Please be reminded that Paul claimed to have been taught directly by the heavenly Jesus. If Jesus was God, he would have been told.

Acts 2:22 “Men of Israel, hear these words: Jesus of Nazareth, a man attested by God to you by miracles, wonders, and signs which God did through him in your midst, as you yourselves also know”

Peter could have said Jesus was (also) God but he didn’t. Instead he described him as a man attested by God. Is there any reference in the book of Acts describing Jesus as God? The book spans several decades after his death.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous of July 3, 2020 at 11:21 PM said...

Why are you frustrated that COGers don't do as you wish ? You are free to live as you wish but they are not.

My response:
Of course, everybody should live as they choose.
The Old Covenant was a Covenant God made with a nation - all of Israel was bound to that covenant.
The New Covenant is not a covenant with a nation - God offers this New Covenant only to individuals.
All are free to accept or reject the covenant - the covenant that is all about freedom.

COGers sincerely desire to live by the Bible.
Most start out innocent and earnest - just wanting to do what is right.

In their innocence, they are deceived by fake ministers, like Weston and Winnail.
These fake ministers get them hooked on little "proofs" that add up to big deceptions.
The big-picture deception includes the lie that the initiates must be obedient to what these ministers say, or they will not enter the Kingdom of God.

These fake ministers spiritually and financially abuse the people they deceive.
These fake ministers don't go close to teaching what the New Covenant is about and also lie about what the "so-called" Christians believe.

So, when I have a conversation with a COGer, and I mention what is really in the Bible, such a grace, justification, sanctification, glorification, the message of the cross, Jesus is the Savior, etc. - these are foreign terms to them. If I quote any of the Holy Scriptures I've quoted throughout this thread, those verses are meaningless to the poor, deceived COGers and they pity me as the "so-called Christian".

The COGers are sacrificing, their finances, families, time, their passions - their whole lives on the belief that if they do what their fake ministers have told them to do, they will earn the Kingdom of God. However, if I tell them they are saved by grace, not works, that is absurd to them. If I say that salvation is a gift, they can't fathom that and would prefer to work for it. They have little interest in Jesus as Savior. It is very frustrating to see people who sincerely, innocently desire the Kingdom be lied to as to how they can receive the Kingdom.

COGers send me links to LCG sermons, and most recently, a link to the LCG Easter telecast. I spend time to pick apart the COG media sent to me, concept by concept, and use Holy Scripture to show how wrong it is. I don't think anyone ever reads what I send as replies to them because no one ever comments on my critiques.

It is extremely frustrating to see anyone - regardless of whether I have a relationship with them or if I do not know them - be scammed out of the most important things in life. God does instruct us to look out for the best interest of the abused and defenseless among us. God also tells us to call out fake ministers. I pray for both the abused COG members and the COG ministers.

Galatians 5:1 It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.

Anonymous said...

Anon, July 4, 2020 at 3:08 PM, said:
******
Since this thread is about Fake News, we might as well discuss whether Jesus was God or not. Not all Christians believe he was God.

What do the gospel accounts claim he said regarding this...

...What about after death?...

...How about the apostles?...

...1 Cor 8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for Him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and through whom we live...

...Peter could have said Jesus was (also) God but he didn’t. Instead he described him as a man attested by God. Is there any reference in the book of Acts describing Jesus as God? The book spans several decades after his death.
******

In fact, if anything, the book of Acts continues to illustrate the distinction between God and Jesus. For example:

Acts 3:13 The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let [him] go.

Even in the Old Testament God inspired Moses to tell us something about that One True God:

Deut 32:39 See now that I, [even] I, [am] he, and [there is] no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither [is there any] that can deliver out of my hand.
:40 For I lift up my hand to heaven, and say, I live for ever.

The words of verse 40 could not apply to Jesus Christ, or the Word.

Time is telling...

John