UCG Sacks Paul Suckling

Another one bites the dust!  UCG is dumping them fast.  Just received an email that UCG has sacked Paul Suckling from the ministry of UCG.



One wonder if he is one of the 168 ministers/elders that signed the petition directed towards UCG HQ honcho's.

Stormy seas ahead!

UCG Troubles Expected To Extend Into Summer 2011

The blog The Shining Light has another post today concerning the current upheavals going on in UCG.  They are predicting that this 'crisis' will continue on until next summer (2011) where a significant number of Elders will have left UCG.

While I am sure some of these men are sincere in their thinking, you have to wonder when it is going to sink into their minds to actually start questioning their entire belief system instead of the politics in UCG.

When your entire faith system is based entirely upon the six month study of a man who was not happy with his wife's new found beliefs and a nightmare she had, something is desperately WRONG!.  Six months. Six months of study in a public library!  Public libraries, then as now, were/are not know for carrying highly intellectual books that really get into the meatier matters of a subject.

Libraries are stocked with books that the general public can read and hopefully understand. Usually with the education of a high school mind or less. That is why libraries are filled with so much fiction.

Libraries at the time of HWA's so-called, super intensive, 'all-encompassing', candle burning study, would still have been stocked with books from the late 1800's.
 
Public libraries at HWA's time were NOT filled with books on eschatology, hermeneutics, and otherwise deep theology.

The mindset of the library reader at that time was revivalist in nature.  Revivalism in the United States at that time dealt with charismatic preachers, emotionalism, altar calls and spur of the moment 'signs of the spirit.'  These people were not book readers. Many were still struggling with day to day life trying to recover from the Great Depression. Ultimately HWA knew that and tapped into the emotionalism of radio to tug at peoples emotions and feelings of wanting to feel special.

If you had been in Pasadena and checked out the 'college' library  you would have seen countless books from the late 1800's through the 1940's.  Ambassador's library was NOT up to date.  When they started the process of accreditation one of the stipulations was getting current and up to update with the books in the library.  You would have found countless anti-catholic books, books on pyramidology by Piazzi Smith, James Rutherford, W.M. Flinders Petri, and others. Lots of books on the JW's, SDA's and the Mormon's. Lots of things on Germany, Hitler, and WWII, extensive Judaism books and more.

How many more decades need to go by before UCG/COG ministers and church leaders stop living in the past.  When will they start using real books for bible study and research or open their minds to current archeology and Biblical studies, and stop relying on HWA?

UCG's so-called 'college', Meredith's so-called 'college' and Flurry's non-college 'college' all uses HWA writings as their standard of belief and formation.  Their standard form of understanding is God's pure language of the King James Bible and HWA's writings pre-1986. You will not find the myriads of books and opinions that a seminary would have in it's library (both pro and con).

A thinking person cannot get a 'rounded' education unless you understand why there are other ways at looking at scripture, theology, and beliefs.  A well educated seminary student looks at these different ways of study and mulls them over.  It does not mean they have to agree with them, but it does open their mind up to explore their own faith, but more importantly it gives them a basis to understand why people think and believe the way they do.

Armstrongism does not do that.  The most they do is read books like Hislop's The Two Babylon's, and any book that is anti-Roman Catholic.  That is as far as their mindset allows them to go.

COG's and HWA loved to mock Roman Catholics and the Orthodox for their supposed idolatry.  What utter hypocrisy!  Look at how COG's cannot carry on a conversation without mentioning HWA or his writings.

Look at the filth rising in Edmond, OK that blatantly worships all things HWA.  Flurry's Herbert W Armstrong College is the ultimate in idolatry! Even Roman Catholics don't worship the Pope this much!

They have what they stupidly believe is HWA's prayer rock that they traipsed through the Oregon woods, dug up and hauled back to Edmond.  There are pictures of Flurry kneeling beside it in reverence.

They bought articles from the Auditorium and furnishings from Pasadena, for their new House of Idolatry.

They pose their pictures, design their TV studio backdrops, books and booklets to look like HWA's version.

They eat the same kinds of foods, drink the same wines and champagne.

They imitate HWA right down to the type of suits, underwear and soap (Roger & Gallet) HWA used!  Pathetic imbeciles!

Well, enough of that rant!  :-)

I do not feel sorry for the current UCG administrations troubles. They brought it on themselves.  They are a group of conniving, greedy men who care only for themselves.  I saw them in action in Pasadena and know for a fact that they are still of the same mindset.  The stories of abuse of members in their congregations make the rounds regularly.

 Shining Light's comments:

It can also be understood that the CoE will not be sad to see dissenting Elders go.  Every one that leaves means a stronger control for themselves.  Every dissenting Elder that leaves is a step closer to the 75% needed to officially change doctrine and discard the cloak of “clarification”.  Every dissenting Elder that leaves means a better chance of reelection for the CoE liberals.  They are in control now and they want to remain in control.

Many of the laity can be expected to follow their Elders in whatever they decide to do.  If an Elder leaves, many of his congregants will follow him.  If a more liberal Elder supports the CoE, many of his congregants will follow along.  The people have been taught to follow the Elder without thinking.
This is a very sad state of affairs, but it is a reality.  We should all be following God and his Word; and following men only as they follow Christ.

That said, there will be a few in each congregation who will not want to play “follow the Elder” and will decide to leave their local Elder; either to remain loyal to the Council, or to register their objections.   This means that both; a sifting of the Elders, and a sifting of the people must come.  That may take some time and may last through to sometime next summer.

We can be sure that the Council has not been wasting their time and that a number of “replacement” Elders are waiting to be sent out to congregations as Elders object to events and leave.  The recent Larry Salyer situation should be a lesson; when an Elder is believed to be unrealiable, he will be removed and a replacement will be waiting to take over.

These replacements will have been handpicked for their liberal leanings and their support of the Council.  The CoE will not allow an Elder to leave and take his flock with him, without a fight.  This is part of what Denny meant by a “Fiery Trial”.  It will be a fight for the people and their financial support.
This is not going to be pretty.

Dennis Luker Says UCG Is "...About to Go Through a Fiery Trial" (Luker Video Added)

The Shining Light blog is reporting that Dennis Luker gave a sermon this past weekend that will most likely be sent out to all UCG churches to be played for the membership.  It looks like the situation in South American has really come back to bite the UCG hierarchy in the butt big time!  There is  an immense backlash about the shenanigans that went on with that situation, with the Salyer episode and other disgruntled ministers. Rocky times are ahead for UCG.

The tape subject was “Fiery Trials”  and it was stated the the UCG/AIC was going through or about to go through a “Fiery Trial”.

It is very important to understand that the only fiery trial, is one being placed on United by the Council of Elders.  All that is needed to prevent such a trial, is for the CoE to confirm and support the previous long standing policy on working or paying others to work on Sabbath; and to begin an honest and sincere effort at reconciliation with the offended Latin American brethren. 

What is so very difficult about that?  In short, all they really need to do to prevent a fiery trial, is to maintain the doctrinal status quo; and reach out to those they have offended in true Godly concern.

So why is Dennis warning of a fiery trial?  Is it because the Council has no intention of maintaining the long standing doctrinal position of United?  Is it because the liberal faction is irrevocably commited to changing the present teaching in favour of the Roig family position?
Why is United’s Council of Elders and President FORCING such a fiery trial on United?

Shining Light also had this to say about Luker:

At one point Dennis says that he is a hard tough man who will do whatever it takes.  He then tried to go on and say;” in love of course”: yet his statement and body language was certainly belligerent and defiant against any possible questioning of his position.

  
This seems to have become a matter of personal pride with the liberals; who seem to be willing to fracture United rather than back off their agenda.
This tape was a rather obvious attempt to intimidate  the elders and people before the important decision come up.

It looks like UCG is starting to go through the same issues that their Mother Church went through.  Those pesky liberals are at it again!




To hear the message yourself check it out.  NOTE:  This is NOT an endorsement of UCG!

Larry Salyer Suspended and "De-credentialed By UCG Honcho's for "Unacceptable Conduct by a Minister"

One has to wonder now which COG Salyer will join next. He has been in so many already. Gotta keep that free money rolling in!  God forbid if he got a real job!

Dear fellow ministers and employees,

We are sad to inform you that we have relieved Larry Salyer of his ministerial duties. He was suspended after he held meetings in the congregations he pastors after services in which he openly criticized the leadership of the Church. This is unacceptable conduct by a minister and the action is what has always been taken against anyone who openly speaks to our brethren in such a manner.

Roy Holladay, regional pastor, was sent to Texarkana, Texas and Ruston, Louisiana to speak to the congregations and let the brethren know of Larry Salyer?s suspension. Roy Holladay mistakenly announced, though, that Larry Salyer?s ministerial credentials were removed. While Ministerial Services can relieve someone of their duties, it is only the Council of Elders that can remove credentials. Roy realized he made a mistake in wording and apologized to Larry Salyer. He also contacted the elders in both congregations and asked them to notify the brethren of this error.

We have wanted to keep this personnel matter just between the parties involved, but write to you because news of this has spread through the Internet. Larry Salyer wrote an open letter that he encouraged be freely shared with all. Because of this we are letting you know the basic facts of this unfortunate situation.

Victor Kubik

Ministerial Services

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Larry Salyer’s Letter

Hello Fellow Elders, (oops! maybe not)

In the midst of great confusion in the United Church of God and especially in the small congregations of Texarkana, Texas and Ruston, Louisiana, it seems appropriate to share the latest events of which I am a witness and a participant. Let me give you a little history before you try to make sense of the message copied below.

On Sabbath, October 9, I chose to bring the brethren up to date on what is going on in the Church. Actually, I had committed to them before the Feast that I would discuss the latest information coming out of the Home Office when we got home from the Feast. (I was only able to be with them on Atonement after the papers came out, due to medical issues with Judy).

The format was the same in each area. First, we had a regular service in which I gave a sermon on the role of shepherds in God’s flock, both in Israel and in the Church. I also explaied how shepherds must deal with “wolves” or lions or bears as David did (I Samuel 17:34-37 are instructive here). After the closing prayer, I invited anyone who wanted to stay for a briefing on the papers and events in the Church. Virtually all stayed. I gave a brief overview of the past several months of conflict and friction in the Church. I then summarized the errors in the two papers and stated unequivocally that they were wrong. I cautioned the brethren to be very alert to any doctrinal drift and not just assume everything that comes out is legitimate. I explained the failure of the unknown authors of these papers to pass them by the doctrine committee. In closing, I mentioned that my saying these things openly, as a shepherd must according to Scripture, would not be well received at the Home Office and that if I were not here next Sabbath they could guess why.

On Thursday evening I returned home to find a message from Denny and Vic asking me to call. When I returned the call Friday morning, I got Denny only. Just let me add that during that phone call Denny said, (very nearly verbatim quote here) “Larry, you have put me in an awkward position. I have to suspend you from ministerial duties until you have talked with Roy Holladay. Roy will come back and write up a report.” He indicated that after that it would be determined what comes next.

For the record I will add here, that I said to Denny ( a long time friend and fellow evangelist in WCG), “Denny, you said I had put you in an awkward position. Let me state here, as one evangelist to another, that I believe you and Roy and others have put me in an awkward position. As a shepherd, I have a responsibility to my flock to help them discern truth and error.”

At that point Denny expressed again that he would have to suspend me until I had talked to Roy. The rest is below.

This information is free to be shared if you think it will be helpful to anyone. I have a limited number of private addresses and do not want to use corporate email. Please see message below from me to Council, President and MS team.

Larry Salyer, October 17, 2010


Following is the email from Salyer on how UCG Honcho's were ticked that he disagreed with the 'Sabbath and Fasting' papers.

Sent: Sunday, October 17, 2010 2:11 AM

To: dennis_luker; melvin_rhodes; bill_eddington; aaron_dean; darris_mcneely; jim_franks; scott_ashley; david_baker; robin_webber; mike_blackwell; david_treybig; bob_berendt; mario_seiglie

Cc: roy_holladay; victor_kubik; gary_anition

Subject: De-credentialing process

Hello,

The phone call this evening caught me completely by surprise for a couple of reasons. First, as I am familiar with the process for approving or removing elder credentials, it seems unlikely to me that such a process could have been followed within the past week, the ostensible reason for such action being statements I made to my congregations last Sabbath. Further, nothing has yet been communicated to me about my credentials as an elder in UCG.

Second, in a phone conversation on Friday morning, President Denny Luker had asked me to confirm or deny accusations that I had addressed the congregations about the Sabbath and Fasting papers and said that I did not agree with them. I said I most certainly had and I believed it was my pastoral duty to the flock to do so. Denny immediately suspended me “from ministerial duties” He instructed me not to attend services on the Sabbath of October 16. He informed me that Roy Holladay would be coming to the area to speak in both churches. I asked him to review that prohibition as I thought it important to the congregation that I be there to hear what was said and to be able to follow up later if I were allowed to continue to pastor. Mr. Luker said he would seek counsel on that and call me back, which he did, saying it was unanimous among the MS team that I should not be at services. Mr. Luker in no way indicated that I was being removed, but repeated that I was being suspended. He said that he and Roy would like for me to meet with Roy and talk. I agreed to do so. He said he hoped I would not make a bunch of calls and stir up trouble. I assured him I would not.

On Friday, I sent an email to all three elders telling them that I would not be there, but that Mr. Holladay would take the sermons. I said nothing about suspension. I spoke to one other member by phone, who asked who would be speaking on the Sabbath. I mentioned that Roy Holladay would be there. Later Roy called me and asked if I could drive to Ruston to meet with him on Sunday morning. I agreed, as he had a long drive to Chattanooga ahead of him.

So what about the phone call? A member called me and gave me a summary of the service. He said that it was announced that my “credentials had been removed.” Incredulous, I said, you mean he said I was suspended. He said no, Mr. Holladay said your credentials had been removed. This was confirmed in another call a little later. Still, I did not believe it and so called the sound person who dubs the CDs. I was allowed to listen to that portion of the announcements (sermonette time) and sure enough Roy said, and repeated in response to a question, that my credentials had been removed and that I was no longer the pastor. Later, I received a call from the other congregation. I asked if the same announcement had been made. The answer was an unequivocal “Yes.”

A couple of questions: When did the COE meet and remove my credentials? If they did not, does the MS team or president now have that authority? If so how and when did they get it? Is it appropriate, prior to a planned meeting on Sunday morning to announce to the members on the Sabbath that my credentials have been removed? Did Roy know what he was talking about? Did he know before he made the appointment with me? Will MS and the Council posture that this was just another misstep? Will they try to retract it after the damage is done? Is somebody lying about the process, or making it up on the fly?

Finally, what is the value in driving 230 miles round trip to meet with a man who has come here in a professional capacity and conducted Church business in such an embarrassing manner?

Paradise Recovered Movie Premiers (Recovery From Fundamentalism)

Andie Redwine was raised in Armstrongism.  After leaving the abuses behind decided to do a movie on helping people escape from abusive religion.

Here are his comments from his blog about the movie, himself and what he hopes to achieve:


 Paradise Recovered

Putting Them Out of Business

For the past decade, I (Andie) have been involved in assisting those whose lives have been devastated by abusive spiritual groups, as well as those silenced by church-sanctioned domestic violence.

This film is for them.
For years, I've looked into the eyes of the walking wounded, and for years, regardless of who they are or what their situation is, they have wondered out loud if anyone gets it. Does their story even matter?

It does matter. It matters enough to be told.

For years, I personally have struggled to come to terms with my own upbringing in a fundamentalist group. The members who helped raise me were and are (for the most part) some of the most loving, dedicated people I have ever known, and many remain close friends. Some are still heavily influenced by this group, some are indifferent, some are atheists, some are healed, some have a radically different faith, and some are no longer with us.

I've been pretty private about this. I am often asked if the script of Paradise Recovered is about me. Certainly my own experiences shaped the story somewhat...a rented hall where services meet...a preacher on a TV screen up front...metal folding chairs and spiral notebooks...lots of rules and regulations necessary for salvation.

But a lot of these stories have come from those who so willingly and often tearfully shared them with me in late night conversations, over coffee, or in Internet chat rooms and forums.

So the layers of the characters came from all of those experiences, but this isn't solely autobiographical. And given the content, there are some difficult moments, but there are definitely some light-hearted ones. It's good to be entertained while you learn.

To answer a question that I am often asked very publicly, yes, I am a person of faith, but my faith looks very different than it used to growing up.

My faith is very much about sharing love with others and caring for their hearts as if they were my own. And it certainly isn't about demanding that someone believe exactly as I do or deciding where someone's eternal destiny lies. It is about demonstrating what I believe to the best of my limited human ability and seeing with spiritual eyes that which I believe God does in spite of my failings. It is about being grateful for what I have been given and giving back as a response.

Often, when I am trying to show someone how abusive groups operate, I will watch a movie with them. Like M. Night Shymalan's The Village. Or the great '70's documentary Marjoe or the more recent Oscar-nominated Jesus Camp. Or a Norwegian film called The Other Side of Sunday.

Once, while I was watching The Other Side of Sunday with a friend, we both noticed how the film dealt with getting out of the group, but it never really dealt with what happens once you get out.

"There needs to be a movie like that," she said.

There did. But I knew nothing about movies, so I decided to write a book instead. A fictional tale called Paradise Recovered.

Sitting around a campfire one Indiana night, a good long-time filmmaker friend, Denis Hennelly, suggested that the story that I was telling really needed to be a narrative film.

"But I don't know anything about writing a screenplay," I countered.
"Well," he said, confidently, "I do."

And so I started writing Paradise as a narrative feature film.
About a month later, I met an old friend, Storme Wood, over breakfast to talk about filmmaking. And, to make a very long story short, we decided to make this film. Together.

Without Denis and Storme and an amazing group of talented actors, producers, and crew, there would be no Paradise Recovered: A New Film. Everyone gave me far more than I knew to ask or even imagined. Many involved had their own stories of abuse and difficulties with sorting out belief, and yet, despite all of the emotional buttons we were pushing, everyone gave everything they had to make this film everything that it could be.

This entire project continues to be a labor of love as a testament to those who have been wounded spiritually by those who were misguided zealots at best, criminal sociopaths at worst.

At the beginning of this project, a very good friend pleaded with me to do all that I could to "put the bastards out of business." It is for her and for the thousands of walking wounded that I continue to press forward.
And it is for a few that I never wanted to help bury that I make this film. I continue to do so in memory of them.

I feel loved and supported by my family, by my extended family and friends, by my community of faith, and by my generous cast of fans on Facebook and in the community who ask, "Now, when is it coming out? What's the movie about anyway? Is it going to be at a film festival in my area? Did you cut the part with me as an extra? Because my mom really wants to see me on the big screen."

As a brief aside, no one is getting rich here. There's this myth that indie filmmaking is about making crazy profits. I hope we do make crazy profits, because this will mean that a lot of the walking wounded will have access to mental health services through either an existing foundation or one that we set up.

And it might just mean that we shared information effectively enough to show that some of these self-proclaimed emperors indeed have no clothes. And maybe they'll be driven to the unemployment line. Permanently.

Heartland Film Festival, October 16, 18, 20, and 21, 2010

Indianapolis Metro Area 

Individual passes may be purchased.

After-party on October 18 to be announced.

Saturday, Oct 16, 2010 at 5:30pm - AMC Showplace 17 Indianapolis

Monday, Oct 18, 2010 at 8:15pm - AMC Castleton Square 

Wednesday, Oct 20, 2010 at 7:45pm - AMC Showplace 17 Indianapolis

Thursday, Oct 21, 2010 at 2:00pm - AMC Castleton Square

Austin Film Festival, October 21 and 24, 2010

Austin, Texas

Individual passes may be purchased 30 minutes prior to showtime. 

Discounted badges and passes are available until September 30.

After-party on October 24 To Be Announced

Thursday, Oct 21, 2010 at 7:00 pm - Rollins Studio Theatre, Long Center for Performing Arts

Sunday, Oct 24, 2010 at 4:00 pm - Spirit of Texas Theatre, Bob Bullock Texas State History Museum

Film Courage Interactive, November 29, 2010

Los Angeles, California

Sponsored by LA Talk Radio's Film Courage with David Branin and Karen Worden

Tickets now available for this one-night event.

Monday, Nov 29, 2010 at 7:00 - 11:00 pm - The Downtown Independent Theatre

An Open Letter to Former Members

An Open Letter To Former Members

Hey everyone! Wow, we've been receiving some really great, heartfelt letters about how the Paradise trailer is affecting you. It's really encouraging to us as we continue to tighten up the rough cut. Here's an excerpt from one of the letters:

“I'm very interested in seeing this movie...after viewing a documentary about a month ago called 'Join Us', it brought back the pain of leaving a cult several years ago…I'll never forget the heartache, even though I'm mostly on the better side of it now."

Two weekends ago, we did a screening with Cara Jean Wahlers and Grover Parido to give them a feel for the film, as well as to discuss the score that they have been working on and ideas they have. At the end of the movie, Cara asked, “Is this what it is like for people who are trapped in these groups?”

Yeah. We think so. The letters and notes that we are getting from people confirm that we have hit a nerve, and that’s just with the trailer.

Here's another part of a letter from a former member:

“I was in a fundamentalist church for 15 years with an authoritarian leader…I was preached against and shunned. Still to this day, I do not go to a church, but still the Lord has me. It's been a journey…There are many of us out on the hillsides.”

Because of these notes and many others, we have decided to put a resources tab on our website to help hurting people network with those who might be able to help, regardless of your desire to have or to not have faith. Healing is possible, and there are some great resources out here…people who will be gentle, recognizing where you have been. It will take me a while to assemble all of that and get it uploaded, so if you want information in the meantime, please use our ‘contact us’ tab.

Additionally, as time permits after we finish the film, we intend to put together some podcasts or videos with cult experts who can provide some understanding about cult recovery and mind control. We have some great friends of this movie, and we indeed intend to help promote their work and passion to raise awareness about how cultic and religious abuse happens.  Helping people heal from abuse is one of the greatest callings on this planet.

Keep the notes of encouragement coming. It means a lot to us to hear how the issue of spiritual abuse has affected you or your loved ones, and we are excited to continue to do what we can to bring this issue to light to bring healing.

We continue to obsess over the rough cut, and we feel a strong gravity to get this story right.  We're not just making a film here -- we are telling the precious stories of people who have had the guts to share them with us.  And truth is always worth telling.

While we are not therapists or trained counselors, this we can say with certainty: no one ever joins a church or a cause expecting to be abused. Some of you were born into these groups without any type of consent whatsoever. Your stories? We believe you. And you deserve to live life to the fullest. There are a lot of great people out here who will be gentle with you.

It wasn’t your fault. You deserve to heal. And it is a long road, but freedom is worth every step.

UCG Crisis Continues To Boil: Income Down, Less Ministers, Less Members

Just another sunny day in the wild and wacky world of Armstrongism!

Abigale Cartwright (ucgcurrent crisis) has listed the following leaders (see below) from UCG that have been suspended in the last few days and through the last year.  It looks like United is not so 'united' as they all claim.

The convoluted background of United's existence started  in the 360/380/390 apartments on the Pasadena campus.

 Ground Zero for the formation of UCG

It was a group of men that gathered with Kubik, Webber and others to plot their separation from WCG.  They had refused to follow in the changes in doctrine that WCG was establishing.  They knew their jobs, their free cars, their homes, their standard of living, paid feast travel, their $10,000.00 +  year-end bonuses, etc was about to change if they did not start toeing the line.  This process went on for several months.  All the time they had these little meetings they continued to stay on the salary of WCG.  Money was their first priority, plain and simple. They certainly were NOT martyrs for the truth as so many claimed they were.

Those of us who lived in the Pasadena area also saw them in action as they 'served' the church in their 'ministerial' duties.  These men were FAAAAAAAR from being ministerial and pastoral in their actions.  Conceited, self-serving jackasses tyrants would be a better description of some of these men.  They were not all bad, but the overwhelming majority were rotten to the core.  They continue their controlling, power hungry ego trips to this day in their splinter cults, UCG included.

UCG recently removed all the regional pastors from their duties:

Excerpt from Kubik letter to ministry: October 13 Letter to Ministry

When United began in 1995, not only was the Regional Pastor system put in place, but a Ministerial Services team was added. It was recognized that this was perhaps too much structure, but we hoped that the Church would “grow into” this structure.

But, today, 15 years later, we have not grown. In fact, we have fewer full-time pastors than we did in the beginning , yet we have continued with this top-heavy structure. It served a much-needed function in its first years by helping write some of the Ministerial Services policies that are now more or less complete and available to the ministry on disk or in the notebook binder.

With the recent change of Presidency and Ministerial Services Operation Manager, it is a good time to reevaluate the Regional Pastor structure. We do not need ten RPs plus a ministerial team to oversee an experienced ministry totaling about 90 full-time pastors and 300 local church elders.
We believe that it is the right time to restructure the management levels within Ministerial Services.

We have decided to discontinue the regional pastor structure as it currently stands. A newly appointed ministerial team will function as regional pastors and perform many of the duties that the former RPs carried out. They will be actively involved in most aspects of current RP duties. Policies that related to the regional pastors will not be changed; they will be fulfilled by the Ministerial Services team who will now act as the new Regional Pastors.

Since United has experienced a downturn in revenue, this leaner management will afford savings as well. We thank all of you for your ministerial support functions over the years. This change will be effective Friday, October 15.

In Christ’s service,

Victor Kubik
Ministerial Services

Dennis Luker
President

Individuals who have resigned or been removed from their positions in the last year

Posted by Abigail Cartwright on October 18, 2010 at 6:30 AM

Larry Salyer, October 2010, suspended from ministerial duties - status pending.

Paul Suckling, October 2010, relieved of his position as Senior Pastor of the United Kingdom

All Regional Pastors removed to be replaced by Ministerial Team October 2010.  These Regional Pastors were: Bruce Gore, Todd Carey, Greg Sargent, Jim Haeffle, Jim Servidio, Larry Grieder, Lyle Welty, Larry Neff and Mike Hanisko. Denny Luker was an RP when he was made president; he was not replaced.   

Mr Hendren  - August 2010 - removed from ministry
Mr. Mendez - August 2010 - removed from ministry
Mr. Garcia - July 2010 - removed as Deacon
Mr. Lovelady - July 2010 - resigned as Treasurer / HR Director
Mr. Walker - June 2010 removed as Director of Spanish Work, removed from the ministry
Mr. Roybal - June 2010 - removed from UCG ministry
Mr. S Langarica - June 2010 - removed from UCG ministry

The following ministers have been removed from the church website in June of 2010 but remain in limbo as an official announcement has not been made

Mr. Dimakis
Mr. Sanchez
Mr A. Lanarica
Mr. Gonzalez
Mr. Mundo Tello
Mr. Ortiz
Mr. Avila
Mr. Hernandez
Mr. Ouijano
Mr. Nain
Mr. Gunez
Mr. Arboleas

The following individuals while removed/resigned or asked to resign continue to be employed as paid elders

Mr. Johnson - May 2010 - not reconfirmed as Corporate Secretary
Mr. Horchak - May 2010 - position on the Ministerial Services team was eliminated when Vic Kubik came in as interim operations manager.
Mr. Thompson - May 2010 - position on the Ministerial Services team was eliminated when Vic Kubik came in as interim operations manager.
Mr. Register - May 2010 - resigned as Director of Educational Services, his position on the Ministerial Services team was eliminated when Vic Kubik
Mr. Kilough - April 2010 - asked to resign as President
Mr. Franks - April 2010 - asked to resign as Operations Manger of Ministerial services
Mr. Salyer - April 2010 - resigned as Operations Manager of Media
Mr. Kilough - July 2009 - resigned from CoE
Mr. Thompson - July 2009 - resigned from CoE
Mr. Foster - July 2009 - removed as Council Reporter

Sex Crazed Long Haired Teens in Prayer Booths and Inter-racial Walking in LCG Camp

A while back on the LCG Yahoo board there was this serious comment about the horrible state of affairs at LCG Summer Camps.  Is it any wonder people mock Armstrongism when there are yahoo's like this posting their stupidity on newsgroups?

Who would have dreamed that prayer booths would be connected with rampaging fornicating teen boys at a Living Church of God Summer Camp!  And what the hell is the problem with walking next to someone of another race.  Is it going to rub off on you?

This stupidity is tied directly into the absurd teachings of British Israelism that still permeates the COGlets to this day.  Whites are superior to all other races.  Meredith still believes it.  Flurry believes it.  Look at both of their splinter cults. White as white on rice.

Photo from Spanky's childhood photo album

Given Spanky's obsession with sex, his constant talking about it in sermons, writing about it in his magazines is it any wonder the kids in his cult want to try it!

Masturbation seems to occupy so much of his mind.  The same goes for Six Pack and his teachings to his cult college students.  I guess HWA's flog log has had a permanent imprint on their minds. (Read about HWA fascination with certain anatomy parts here AR 27 )

The second Sabbath at camp on 7-28-07 RCM gave a sermon about prayer.
During the course of the sermon he suggested that the church give "a
few thousand dollars" to the camp so they could build some prayer booths
for the teenagers. 

The first question about that idea is whether or not

it is an appropriate use of tithe money to give it to a facility they do
not even own? 

The second question regards if RCM is so naive as to not
realize what teenagers could end up using those booths for instead? 
I happen to have firsthand knowledge that one teenage boy and girl
successfully fornicated despite the so-called watchful eyes of
supervising adults at the camp. Thankfully this situation was not
further complicated by a pregnancy! 

Another eye catching event was the presence of at least 4 boyswith long hair. How long? It covered their ears and the back of their necks. The previous year this was non-
existent. I was told by a minister and staff member that the staff
camp manual had a grooming guideline of no long hair for boys. Yet last
year it was allowed. Did the camp director not have the courage to
contact the parents and tell them the boys would have to get haircuts
or go back home?
Does this alleged evangelist not understand I Cor.
11:14 ?

Last noteworthy occurrence was the teenagers given the latitude to decide whether or not to couple up interacially in the march to
Sabbath services. This decision should be the domain of the adults not
the children. This was not allowed in WCG camps under HWA. The only
exception was an odd number of teenagers per race which made 100%
coupling impossible. This was a sound practice put in place by the last
living Apostle and no one in a lesser office has the authority to
change it.