With the immense tragedies here in Southern CA with the fires, it has been amazing to watch as people immediately banded together within hours to start providing clothing, essentials, and housing for those displaced. Churches and Jewish centers were some of the first to start relief efforts. Local charities and companies started efforts down at the Rose Bowl and later moved to the Santa Anita Race track when the Bowl needed to be used for stationing firemen and electric company line repairmen.
“But this I say: He who sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and he who sows bountifully will also reap bountifully. So let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver.” (II Corinthians 9:6-7) is often read before taking up an offering, as if it applies to giving money to a corporate organization. But, when you read the context in II Corinthians 8, it is really about collecting an offering for another congregation (in Jerusalem) in need.
So beyond the misuse of the scriptures for something it’s not talking about, let’s stop and consider whether we have ever had a request to help another congregation in need. Have you seen a collective effort for food, water, money, supplies, etc., for example, for a congregation in an area that has been devastated by a tornado, a wildfire, or a hurricane? Have volunteers from the COG congregations poured into those communities to help out?
The short answer is “No.” The corporate COG groups diss “so-call Christians” for many things, and yet these are the very people who respond in a tangible way after a disaster. Want to make disciples and preach the gospel? Live it by helping and serving others, especially when their worlds have been turned upside down.
In fact, is this any different than what we will be doing when Jesus establishes God’s kingdom on the earth? Humans who are still alive are going to be shell-shocked and they will need the most basic of their needs met. Food, water, shelter, clothing.
Someone thumping on a Bible and “preaching” at them won’t help them a bit. Someone helping provide those basic necessities will. In the process, they will see the fruit of God’s spirit on display: agape, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control. That will make an impact, considering what they have just experienced, and that’s the first step.
One of the things that the COG groups imply is that we’ll have offices and ranks and we will sit on thrones and direct little underlings, but you and I won’t actually get in there and get our hands dirty laboring to help people. For me, that’s no better than the idea of going to heaven and playing a harp for eternity. Lifting Scriptures Out of Context
What we have witnessed here in Southern CA is the beauty of the people in the area and the kindness and goodness in their hearts. Their immediate thought was about "the other" and not themselves. In Armstrongism it was always about us first because we were special and set apart and never on "the other".
Can you imagine a Church of God doing what this church is doing this coming Sunday?
I will take that any day over the belching toads like Bob Thiel or Gerald Flurry and the adulterated filth they preach.
61 comments:
The churches of God are not fully Christian churches.
The LA fires are tragic and frightening to watch. As is the disaster that befall Mayotte in the Indian Ocean and Vanuatu in the pacific. And the catastrophic civil war in the Sudan and Libya and Syria. The Gaza Israel conflict. The darkness that has fallen on Afghanistan, especially for women. The savage oppression in North Korea. Or for the homeless in the USA. A pattern of sadness and sorrow wherever we look. Time and chance happen to anyone. Jesus was moved to compassion when he looked at Israel there before Him, as sheep without a shepherd. In the light of this suffering around us I hope our hearts are moved with the same compassion as our Messiah. Many religious organisations have collection boxes in their churches synagogues for parishioners to collect funds , that are then forwarded onto various charities. The Armstrong movement could learn from this.
Part of my early career education involved a couple of years spent as a life and disability insurance agent, and my territory was west Altadena, and northwest Pasadena. For those who have never been to California, that means that the majority of my policyholders were Black and Latino, and most of my daily working hours were spent with my policyholders. All socioeconomic classes were represented in this territory, and as one travelled northwards, the homes became nicer and more opulent. Altadena was advanced and forward-thinking in that redlining was not practiced there, either by the city, the banks, or realty firms. So a very unique community sprang up. Many of the kids were students at Pasadena City College. My experience in that time was most definitely good, as my lifelong practice has always been to make my customers my friends, and we had many wonderful discussions, certainly not just limited to insurance. Always having been into music, particularly rock and the blues, I especially enjoyed the insights gained from our musical discussions. Music is the universal language, after all, and some of my policyholders had had musical careers during the birth of rock n roll.
That may have been many years ago, but I've just been completely devastated and depressed over the past week by what the fires have done to the community there. I remembered many of my friends/clients' names and faces, and different salient things that were said during my visits to their homes. Most of them would be at a very advanced age now, if indeed they were alive. Many of the homes which burned may have been passed down to the chidren and grandchildren. I'm certain there are predatory developers swooping down, as we speak, trying to get those properties for pennies on the dollar, and I've read comments by the fire victims expressing fear that the neighborhoods may be "gentrified", with the original residents being displaced or crowded out as a result of new development. WCG members certainly lived in that community back in the day, and its possible that some of our former brethren have lost everything, just as did their neighbors.
There have to be ways in which those who are able can help the ones whose lives were uprooted, and can be sure that the money gets to the right places. This whole thing is just so sad. It's bad enough for the people in Pacific Palisades, the Malibu colony, or places like Topanga Canyon, but the fact is many of the folks from those areas already have really good resources, and the basic tools for recovery.
I really enjoyed Treme, a TV series about New Orleans in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina. People are resilient, and just as was New Orleans, Altadena will be rebuilt. It's just hard to see the sun behind all of the smoke right now.
BB
You're overlooking LifeNets, which is still connected with United Church of God.
It posted a fire relief effort a week ago, working with UCG-LA - a congregation which admits at least a couple of members lost their homes.
“ The excuse that Armstrongism has always used is that God will fix it all later in the millennium, so why waste efforts and especially money on the unconverted, unclean masses. Of course, this proves just how easily the church twisted scripture to fit their desired result.”
This quote is true. Everyone was discouraged in giving to charities or helping people in need. That is unless it was HWA himself for various projects the church was involved in. The WCG could give members hard earned money to whatever cause they wanted: overseas projects, international schools or for the purchase of gifts to sway international leaders. But the moment you give outside of the church yourself, it was definitely discouraged. If we gave for fire or flood victims it was viewed as what those soppy Christians do. We should know God was sending the victims or the world a message to wake up and if we gave or helped it was like we were getting in the way of Gods punishment.
Spent many years in PCG and this was the same thinking. There was preaching about the way of give and love and yet it was completely lacking. I felt our hands were tired in individual giving throws outside tue church. The brainwashing is real.
“ The excuse that Armstrongism has always used is that God will fix it all later in the millennium, so why waste efforts and especially money on the unconverted, unclean masses. Of course, this proves just how easily the church twisted scripture to fit their desired result.”
This quote is true. Everyone was discouraged in giving to charities or helping people in need. That is unless it was HWA himself for various projects the church was involved in. The WCG could give members hard earned money to whatever cause they wanted: overseas projects, international schools or for the purchase of gifts to sway international leaders. But the moment you give outside of the church yourself, it was definitely discouraged. If we gave for fire or flood victims it was viewed as what those soppy Christians do. We should know God was sending the victims or the world a message to wake up and if we gave or helped it was like we were getting in the way of Gods punishment.
Spent many years in PCG and this was the same thinking. There was preaching about the way of give and love and yet it was completely lacking. I felt our hands were tired in individual giving throws outside tue church. The brainwashing is real.
The answer to the post question is yes, when disaster strikes they are ready to respond and lend a hand. Are you?
That is because Christian churches of any denominations contains flawed humans.
In today's culture a strong toxic culture of misogyny is destroying many a congregation.
Our organization is helping a LOT. We are not publicizing it, nor will we.
I think that is the case with many of the COGs.
This has always been my problem with the COG groups. When asked, "What do you do?" the answers boil down to nothing other than serving themselves. To live as an example, to show the application of Truth in the real world is not in their self-interest.
"The excuse that God will fix it all later in the Millennium"???
I understand the scope of the post and comments, but I think it is a mistake to disparage the FACT that there ARE things only God can FIX!
626 offers a short list of human problems, such as disasters, war, conflicts, oppression and suffering. How many of these can be FIXED by " man", by collecting funds and forwarding them to various charities? There is a big difference in helping people in need and fixing a problem. BB talks about getting money to the right places, which is a legitimate concern seeing that a major problem today is charity fraud which runs rampant. Even respectable charities like the Red Cross and the United Way have histories of misuse of funds, overpaying executives, and outright fraud. How do WE fix that?
What about so called "climate change"? How are we going to fix this as long as China, the biggest polluters, gets a free ride to pollute as they please? Will blindly wreaking our economy compensate for that?
Jordan Peterson has correctly stated that " the solution is often worse than the problem. How can you solve (fix) a problem when you can't even measure the consequences of your actions? What are the consequences of the solution "??
He further states, " it's hard to separate the science from the politics. We need solid goals and priorities, not wish lists of special interest groups " which dominate this world system.
Crisis problems are complicated, not simple or easy to solve. We should definitely love our neighbor as yourself and do good to all men as we have opportunity. But in this world system, there are many many things WE CANNOT FIX because of our human frailties and satanic deception, but Jesus Christ can and will, when He chooses to do so. THY kingdom come!
10.18, this reminds me of once asking a minister his opinion on pursuing an interest outside the church. I could tell by his body language that since this would not directly benefit the church, forget it. This is another example of ACOG members being viewed solely as resources to be exploited by their church. Members hopes and dreams mean nothing in these groups. Playing church is all these ministers care about.
I was raised in Worldwide and later went to LCG. I no longer go to LCG, because I am disappointed that when we have disasters close to home, such as Helene, no one from that church(leaders) stimulate their members to get out there and be a light for Jesus. Helping your fellow man is part of the ministry that is missing. They want us to give to the church with tithes, but won't help people who are hungry and homeless because of natural disasters. I believe if Armstrong was alive today he would contribute to these fire victims and flood victims. Shame on the COG churches who won't help these victims, and Thank you to the COG church who did. Thank you to the many Protestant, Jewish and Catholic organizations who stepped up to the plate. We are all human beings who will fall down and worship Jesus one day.
BP8, I'm sure all of us in some ways live in our own little bubbles from which we get the cliches we adapt as our paradigms. The comments you made about China are seriously outdated, and have been for some time. If you will take the time to type "How is China Tackling Climate Change?" into your browser, information which may surprise you will come up on the list of articles. There is an article from no less an authoritative source than the London School of Economics and Political Science which reports on and clarifies China's commitment to neutral carbon footprint by 2060, and chronicles the incredible progress they have already made. Many Chinese sites will also come up, but I cite instead a source where the evaluation of China's progress is more of a critical nature. There are also United Nations sites, with supporting articles, but too many believe that the UN is part of the "New World Order" and therefore would be biased.
It makes sense that Chinese industry would be geared towards minimizing carbon footprint, because their products are popular around the world, and "green" products enjoy a huge sales advantage. The technology involved in their EVs is much more advanced than our own at this point.
Gary may have given us a good starting point in our desires to be of help. The 'dena Love Day poster he reproduced! There is a phone number listed for LaToya Carr in the lower right hand corner, through which an inquisitive person might be able to obtain some satisfying answers.
From many pertinent news articles over the past thirty years, I have constantly read of two major church groups, Church of God in Christ, and African Methodist Episcopal Church, both of which I would have to believe would be very much in the forefront of relief efforts.
I don't think anyone here believes that helping people in a disaster is going to permanantly resolve the greater human issues and problems the world is experiencing. Physical things were destroyed, so It all appears physical and temporary. But those who have read Lonnie's recent article on Tuesday Jan. 14 on the Kingdom of God will definitely have some positive insights on exactly what can be accomplished!
BB
https://churchofgodnetwork.org/programs/within-your-gates-fundraiser-resources-for-ca-wildfires/
The questions which some will have on this link, 11:47 will be, which ACOG is the hosting organization? Also, is it their intention to assist the greater community, or just their own members.? There is no wrong answer to that question. It's just that people who contribute will want to know where their donation is going. One person might want to be aiding his church brethren, while another might prefer to donate to the victims at large.
BB 1037
China has made numerous pledges and commitments in the past that they have backed out of so I'm not real impressed with any promises they make about human rights, trade, or a neutral carbon footprint. Like you point out, "climate change" is good for their economy so why would they not embrace and promote the United Nation's official narrative?
Also, you are right about one thing. For multiple reasons I AM biased when it comes to the UN. It is a consequence of living in my own little bubble governed by my personal worldview. But hey, it's MY worldview, not one manufactured and promoted by this world system.
I can't wait to read all the COGlodytes' responses to this when they get out of their sabbath services! 🌅
There be some dramas inside their pajamas tonight!
OK. Got it. So because China reneged on certain promises in the past (which you did not explain or enumerate) we get to assume that their commitment to neutral carbon footprint by 2060 is a total sham, and to excuse our own lack of belief and piss poor performance based on this This, in spite of international rewards and commendations they are currently receiving!
Boy, I wish I were able to,support my beliefs in myths by such logic! But then again, not everyone is able to escape from Armstrongian logic.
BB
There's also the UCG "Good Works" program - which I wish Rick Shabi would have mentioned in his "Biblical Worldview" video on the fires:
BB, so you love and trust China. That's ok. I bet if we took a poll, most Americans would not agree.
Do rewards and commendations really prove anything? Didn't Hillary just receive the Presidential Medal of Freedom from sleepy Joe, the guy who pardoned his criminal son? Didn't the pharisees praise and honor one another?
I noticed you didn't elaborate when accusing me of engaging in "myths". I guess Armstrong logic afflicts us all!
Heh. Yeah. Let's just find some other excuses why it's just too big for us to do anything about it now. Even though there are things we could do that we just don't like.
What an ignoramus you are, BP8! Of course I do not love and trust China. Only a black and white i-o thinker would take the exact opposite of the points I was making and throw that hot mess back in my face. Can you say "Straw Man"???Everything is not black or white, one polar opposite or the other. Real life is always about percentages. Trust is never 100%, and unconditional love is not even achievable by humans. Hillary Clinton, Joe and Hunter Biden, and the Pharissees have nothing to do with whether the Chinese are taking steps to mitigate anthropogenic climate change. You believe dealing with climate change is philosophically too radical for the Chinese? Look at how seriously they took their own population control starting in 1979, although the mandates have now been somewhat relaxed and financial incentives have replaced them. Had their birth rate continued, Chinese people would have eventually won planet Earth simply by becoming the predominant ethnicity! Hard right Americans profess to hate the Chinese, but hop into their cars to race to Walmart to buy the latest Chinese products. Wall Street courts and seduces all the Chinese investors who'll give them ear time. But, yeah. There's all them nasty bubble cliches, can I get an "Amen"?
Even if the Chinese were total Satanic trash, it's a bogus argument that because another huge group does not care about the environment, we should give up our own efforts and just let the planet die. Our percentage of the total effort needed will still achieve some good! Remember how HWA always poo-pooed anything the Russians did, told us not to worry, and refocussed us on the Germans (his bogus Assyrians) in accordance with his own prophecy mold? Well, now Armstrongites want us to ignore a competing apocalypse, which is how they view climate change. So, we read all of these ridiculous diversions and ignorant pseudo arguments.
Ya know, I sometimes ridicule conspiracy theories, but my favorite two words have always been "as appropriate". I have a conspiracy theory of my own. Totally appropriate, It's that the Chinese engineered and released Covid 19 as their response to the tariffs President Trump imposed upon them during his first term. I believe they realized that a military response would have been far more disruptive to international commerce.
It is the Russians who do not care about the environment, and have no problem starting irrational wars. As bad as that is, it does not make the Russian people 100% Satan-level evil. Even that is still a matter of percentages that binary thinkers will never understand! India is also sometimes cited as being remiss in reducing their national carbon footprint. They realize that all of their great rivers upon which civilization is built are glacially sourced. Much of India's national effort is devoted to protecting their local glaciers.
Like I said. Just need to get out more, and read a bit more widely!
BB
Can I clarify that this blog is in favour of the climate change being real and not a sham?
Of course it is in China's own long term interests to invent revolutionary new ways to manufacture all the trades they already dominate without harming the planet.
Anon202,
It’s a given that people are flawed. The problem with the cogs is they turn a blind eye to most suffering and damage their souls by continuing ly hardening their hearts by ignoring today’s suffering by saying only Christ’s return can help…and that may be many years from now. Focusing almost primarily on the return of Christ without teaching of the Hope of today misses the mark for what is the Gospel for a Christian. Other denominations do generally understand the Gospel, but not the COGs. A merciful God is the only hope for the COGs’ false gospel teaching.
You might be asking us to herd cats by your question, 1:25. A blog is a community composed of individuals. There are many opinions, diverse opinions which keep a blog alive and healthy. Were that not true, there would be nothing to stimulate discussion. There is a statement of purpose for Banned by HWA, one that expresses what the blog is in favor of. Exposure of Armstrongism, a process which has many aspects and approaches. How we get there varies in accordance with each of our perspectives. Some who wish to preserve and retain Armstrongism also participate.
There is great freedom here, for which we can all thank Gary. (No2HWA) It's not easy to do what he does.
BB
125
Since you speak for everybody on this blog, why not identify yourself by something other than "anonymous"?
BB 1039
You are absolutely correct that " trust is never 100%", if it's even possible at all. So you want us to play a numbers game, where those in authority get to define what is orthodox and what is not. You lived through that once, I'm surprised you didn't learn a lesson.
Questions to consider. Who decides what is orthodox and what is not, and why? Who decides what is historically accurate and what isn't? Who determines who are the good guys and who are the evil ones on this planet? You? Me? The government, the UN?
This site is built on challenging an orthodoxy. It does that by pointing out flaws in the official narrative and offering alternative points of view. Because of time and space, I tend to generalize for brevity sake. It is not because I'm not well informed or one dimensional in my reading.
Consider "climate change", which is a massive subject to say the least. Wikipedia presents a summary of the United Nation's liberal official narrative, while the site Conservapedia offers a polar opposite view, which is very compelling. Both views are very lengthy and to cover them on this site, point by point, would take years. I think you knew that already, but you wanted to burden (silence) me with the responsibility of providing opposing facts that you would reject anyway, and then offer your own brand of generalization about awards and commendations which proves nothing.
I admit, both views have credence, but which view is right and how do we know? Who do we trust and why? Is the planet really dying? Who says? Is it a matter of majority rule, might makes right, or that the orthodoxy is always right? Well, they certainly were not right when they crucified the Son of God!
I have a Bible based worldview that affirms the existence of a spiritual dimension of reality and its importance for how we understand the world around us and live our lives. What about you BB, what is your worldview based on? Percentages? Corrupt orthodoxies, the spirit of error verses the spirit of truth? Think about it. No straw man here!
You can "herd" cats to a certain extent by various ways depending on a persons cat knowledge.
One is rattling a newspaper at them, they don't like the rustling sound and a more obvious one is holding an freshly opened no drain tuna steak tin. Cats would follow anyone to the moon and back holding such an item.
I would say herding cats is easier than herding commentators on this blog.
None of those who purport to interpret the scriptures have any authority from God. None of them. Whether WCG, LCG, RCG, PCG, the pope, the protestants, or any other preacher or bible teacher. Not one has any credentials from God.
BP8~
I'm not the blog's spokesman, although it might seem to you that I'm currently the loudest voice.
You asked many questions about views. I would ask you to redirect those same questions, nearly verbatim, to what you state in your final paragraph.
What I read in Genesis indicates that God's desire for Adam was that he would be a good steward for what God lovingly created for us as our physical home. I also read of Global warming in Revelation. There are numerous warnings about the world's system of commerce and the runaway influences of greed and money.
The things that are happening to planet Earth are totally measurable. We have detailed information about the climate from millennia old ice core samples in the arctic regions. The content of all levels of the Earth's atmosphere is totally measurable. Coral bleaching is not someone's runaway imagination. It is observable as is the temperature of the oceans surrounding it. Micro particles of the plastics generated in the huge garbage gyres in all of our major oceans are choking the sea creatures, many of which are no longer edible due to mercury content. Forever chemicals (slowly lethal) are in the groundwater table and find their way into the crops which feed on it, as well as our drinking water. Antarctica is calving huge ice sheets which are the size of some of our smaller states, fresh water ice which required thosands of years to accumulate, and will melt in the ocean. Permafrost which traps carbon and methane is melting, now adding even more greenhouse gasses to the atmosphere.
I just don't know how you get past all of these things!
Know what, BP8? The sad secret amongst people really in the know is that something should have been done about this when the alarm bells first sounded back in the 1970s. Unfortunately, people turned it into a political party line issue. Consequently this discussion is actually useless because it's already too late, and the best we can do is perhaps modify our behavior to slow it down! I can honestly see why you believe that this problem might be too big, and unsolvable, so let go and let God. Where we differ, it that I liken it to people preparing for a hurricane. I believe we should be doing all we can to mitigate the damage!
BB
"Leave the dead to bury the dead."
Climate change is not man made. It has been going on since the ice ages and long long before that.
We know, 1:07. But this is different because there are people on the planet, the changes are measurable, and they are accelerating towards disrupting the fixed set of constants required so that life can exist on the planet. You're not helping by repeating a right wing think tank cliche that is not relevant to our present circumstances. That's the kind of thing Herman Hoeh would have come up with to support HWA.
BB--1233
I'm not unsympathetic about the plight of our planet and race. I'm concerned whether climate change (CC) is the real emergency it's made out to be or is it being manipulated to advance the Global agenda. You may poo-poo the idea of the NWO, but the idea is based on the premise that global problems demand a global response which requires a global government. We saw that come up during the pandemic.
You stated, "I don't know how you get past all these things"!
Forever chemicals and micro plastics are a real threat, but should they be under the umbrella of CC? CC proper (heating, cooling) is a reality but to what extent is it problematic? You say it is measurable but that's where the controversy begins.
Conservapedia lists multiple challenges to the official narrative. Examples are
--is it a real emergency?
--historical data on the earth's heating, cooling cycles
--flaws in temperature tracking
--data manipulation with examples
--rising ocean temperatures based on faulty science
--the accuracy of forecasting models
--failed CC predictions
--a list of scientists and published papers calling the official narrative a myth
This gets us back to square one. Who's right, who's wrong, and how can we really know?
I know you are passionate about this and I don't want to make light of the real dangers that threaten us. This has turned into a political party issue and I think it borders on the ridiculous that CC has now become a catch all for every imaginable consequence of sin that befalls us. By doing that, they can produce a few EVs , shut down a pipeline or 2, and give the illusion they are tackling forever chemicals, air and water pollution, cancer, and a host of other things WHEN THEY ARE NOT!
I don't know if the book of Revelation is referring to CC as we define it, but I do know judgment is reserved for "them which destroy the earth", Rev.11:18. It's only a matter of time.
BB,
It would surely help if the Dem leadership weren’t foolish people. Billions of tonnes of CO2 are released into the atmosphere each year. In 2022 it was 5 billion tonnes which is more than every country in the world except China.
The Newsoms and Basses of the world in efforts to “save” a plant or an endangered animal in a specific locale will sacrifice the lives of many and create turmoil in the lives of hundreds of thousands by not making sure reservoirs are filled and hydrants and trucks working. Controlled burns of brush would have helped too as there is a heck of a lot more carbon in large trees and homes than in weeds and shrubs. As it is, the dems exacerbate the issue by being responsible for a substantial increase in the yearly release of co2 due to the la fires. And the removal and replacement of homes and businesses and vehicles is a bump in CO2 emissions yet to come.
BrtB
The underlying problem that prevents the Armstrongism movement from providing assistance to victims of the disaster du jour or their neighbors in need on a daily basis is the LAW. Well, not the law per se, for the law is holy, but Armstrongism’s relationship with the law surely is unholy.
Armstrongism preaches adherence to the law of the Old Covenant while Armstrongites believe they are really keeping that law. The absurd blindness of the Armstrongites to the fact that they are merely trying to keep Herbie’s abridged, proprietary law blend is sad; the fact that Armstrongites feel superior to all others for keeping this odd law blend, is ugly.
Armstrongism teaches that one must keep the obsolete Ten Commandments and thereby exhibits one of the many indicators that Armstrongism is not a Christian religion. Jesus forever changed, updated, magnified the Ten Commandments. Preaching the obsolete Ten Commandments leaves Armstrongism stuck in the obsolete covenant and uninterested in what God requires of Christians under the New Covenant. Far more is required of Christians under the superior New Covenant – requirements that are entirely missed by the poor Armstrongites.
Smug Armstrongites believe that they are keeping the law if they avoid stealing and don’t murder. However, dealing with their neighbors with that narrow mindset is breaking the law of the New Covenant. Withholding physical sustenance from a neighbor in need is stealing, while turning a blind eye to the needs of the suffering may indeed be murder under a magnified law.
Regardless of where a disaster occurs, Christians will always jump into action because the law of loving their neighbor is written in their hearts. Christians may never stop to consider that if they don’t feed their neighbors then they are stealing bread from their mouths. Christians may not be likely to contemplate that if they don’t lend a hand then they are effectively saying that they don’t care if their neighbor lives or dies, and thereby be guilty of murder. Christians just automatically put love into action and do what needs to be done because the law of the New Covenant is written on their hearts. Christians are aware of and are inspired by what Jesus has done for them and they want to cast that same love on to those who need it.
Yes, many people trapped in Armstronite cults are Christians but as a whole, the Armstrongite movement is not Christian and does not teach the law of the New Covenant – the record is long and deep. Armstrongism, as a whole is missing out on knowing God and obeying his commands.
Since Armstrongism is more interested in the Old Covenant and the Old Testament, I suggest that Armstrongites who care about obeying God and keeping his law, come to know the God of Justice by studying Psalm 146:1-10, or know the God of Justice, as Job did, as displayed in Job 29:11-18.
Is there an anti-Armstrong site for adults out there somewhere? Someone tell me where. Please.
HA HA HA HA HA! Another crybaby pops on here and gets their itty bitty feelings hurt because people have different opinions than theirs. Yet here you are, just like all the other miserable people who pop on and whine every once in a while. You cant stay away.
First of all, BP8, my current concerns and beliefs represent a major paradigm shift for me. While I was a responsible career-orientated working person throughout my life, I had a somewhat secret life as an outlaw street racer well into my 50s. Never on my bikes, (too dangerous) only with my cars. You might categorize my hobby as having been a mass polluter. Even worse, I got into the chemistry of it all with fuel. Bought 5 gallon jerry-cans of 110 octane avgas at the airport, found tetraethyl lead after it was taken out of commercial automotive gasoline, and experimented with alternative fuels.
All this aside, and more importantly, people generally do not understand science except on a superficial level. This has been proven in court cases where science is invoked. I've watched folks on your side of the fence not accept dna science, and this is because they simply do not understand it, so autodefault to their original conclusions without delving deeply enough for it to make a difference.
Your list of questions from Conservapedia, are just that. Questions. I've seen all of these addressed exhaustively in places where there is far more dedicated space and time to do so. Ultimately, conclusions must be drawn by each of us as individuals as to whom to trust. How about having no gurus? Study a wide variety of sources, and come up with your own amalgam. Trust those who do the best job of passing constant retesting. HWA referred to "proving all things" and then expected us to make him our personal arbiter of truth, and not to consult sources which challenged him. One "proved all things" by reading what HWA said, nodding ones head in agreement, and then spending the rest of one's life searching specifically for the statements and opinions which confirmed what he taught, mostly ignoring all counter opinions, but occasionally pondering the simplistic ones. This was a very bad template he set for us all.
Conservapedia notwithstanding, coral is bleaching, ancient arctic fresh water glacial ice is melting and calving, sea creatures are dying off due to changing conditions in their constantly shrinking habitats, and ocean level is rising. The currents which strongly influence weather patterns are measurably weakening. Clearly, there is causation somewhere. Actually, when you think about it, nature is winning this discussion! You and I are just observers commenting upon the process.
BB
Politicians are not to be trusted, BrtB! There is massive stupidity and massive corruption in both of the major parties. Neither offers a perfect solution. That said, there are some good aspects to the platforms in each. I look towards the ones which fit with my own philosophies and needs.
The only honest politician I ever knew was my grandfather, one of our elected representatives in the legislature of our state when I was a young pup. He voted his conscience and would not play ball.
BB
All of us are young at heart, 11:11! Doesn't that corncob hurt???
So hard to post while using my cellphone. I left out a key phrase above “billions of tonnes of co2 are released into the atmosphere ‘due to wildfires.’
5 billion tonnes a year. This is more than any country except China which releases 12.5 billion tonnes.
There are ways to reduce solar warming. They were considered andused experimentally when the O3 (ozone) holes were a greater concern.Not sure why some of these are not being used in the face of such dire predictions. It reminds me somewhat of the claimed existential threat trump was to some before the election but now after the election they don’t seem too concerned because as politicians they know they were lying for political gain. We’re told global warming is an existential threat but the only efforts are to reduce the amount of co2. There are ways to reflect moree solar energy back ito space that aren’t prohibitively expensive.
So, one wonders whether it is again primarily geopolitical.
BrtB
Another crybaby pops on here and gets their itty bitty feelings hurt because people have different opinions than theirs.
Who are you referring to, yourself? You wouldn't be Bob Thiel would you?
Not 11:11. I guess average respect for another human isn't in the New Covenant you claim to follow and shout aloud that Sabbatarian Christians don't know.
Why jump to conclusions of such negativity of others lives? Why the need to promote a negative narrative on others lives?
Hi Bob.
It certainly appears as if we're in for a really rough ride, BrtB, one that has been missed by Armstrong-based prognosticators mainly because it has nothing to do with the HWA "hook". Unlike them, I really hope that I'm wrong, but we'll certainly see.
The Russians have made an unfortunate discovery of a huge crude oil reserve estimated at over 500 billion barrels, lying beneath Antarctica. We can only imagine the devastating effects that will have on the planet if efforts are made to harvest it.
BB
Thanks for the discussion/sharing opinions on your views of the climate change situation BP8, BB and BrtB.
Why jump to conclusions of such negativity of others lives? Why the need to promote a negative narrative on others lives?
It's what people do when they do not have a valid argument.
By the way, I was totally unfamiliar with the the Conservapedia. To hear BP8 cite it as an authority, I had imagined that it might be of similar stature to the National Review, or the American Spectator. Maybe even Breitbart. But alas! I now believe that I was just pranked.
I'll leave it to the audience at large to visit that site, and make your own determinations. Check out the article on the Beatles, (I always preferred the Animals and the Stones) and you will get a real good overview of the depth and editorial policy of Conservapedia.
Beware! It's most likely to be one of the cornerstones of the new "Golden Age" of America.
BB
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Conservapedia is just another information clearing house and was created to counter the liberal bias of Wikipedia. I use it like I would any encyclopedia, as an source of information.
Other than liberals, who says Conservapedia is any less authoritative than the New York Times or any other publication of the liberal press? It is biased? Sure, what isn't? This world system is biased, which is why I question the "official" narrative regardless where it originates or whatever the subject matter. Scripture says, "let no one deceive you by any means", 2 Thes.2:3.
The real prank of the week is the pardon of the Golden boy and spokesman for the covid official narrative, Dr. Fauci. You remember him don't you BB, "trust the science"? Conservapedia is looking better all the time!
I question the "official" narrative regardless where it originates or whatever the subject matter.
Most people seem to be completely incapable of seriously doing that on any topic. They need to be told what to think, and they feel secure going with the flow of the accepted experts. But history shows that the accepted experts are often liars and/or simply deceived.
It's certainly not university-quality material, BP8, and that is type of reference material for which I've been trained to look. I also attempt to find primary source materials as opposed to later quotations of them. I hang around here mostly because there are a few very well-educated regulars who consistently share brilliant dissertations with us, as well as their humanity.
BB
The past week, I'd been so disappointed that with all the people President Biden was pardoning and commuting other' sentences, I had not yet seen the name of Leonard Peltier. And then, finally! His last official act. Leonard gets to go home after serving 50 years for something he did not do. đź‘Ť
BB
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Even though I'm not considered to be one of those well educated regulars you speak of, I do enjoy and appreciate the dissertations, although, on a site where the primary game played Eric Berne would call "Ain't ARMSTRONG Awful", I don't see a whole lot of university quality research presented.
You do know what an encyclopedia is don't you?--a tertitary source which is not always100% reliable (but what is?), and may contain inaccuracies, but is good for quick summary information. Both Wikipedia and Conservapedia post disclosures admitting this.
If you go back and read my comments you will find I never cited Conservapedia as an authority, only as an alternative challenge to the official liberal narrative. Whether it meet one's criteria would be determined by one's bias. Of course we all know how scholarly the official narrative is supposed to be but sometimes isn't. When testifying before Congress, Mr. Science Dr. Fauci, the guy who needed pardoned for some reason, said that the 6 foot rule seemed like a good idea at the time, that " it was not based on scientific data, but just sort of happened ". Then there's that faulty PCR test!! Very academic but unreliable.
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Good comment. You present no academic sources, but your common sense wisdom makes your point very well!
It could be up to 80% of people who will go along with the official/mainstream narrative — this is why prophets and whistleblowers have such a hard time.
Presumably the experts in the law went along with the idea that it was “expedient... that one man should die for the people, and that the whole nation perish not”.
Chapter title: “Linear thinking in a non-linear world” (1990).
Book: “Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds” (Charles Mackay, 1841).
A future global cooling trend will hopefully put an end to climate alarmist:
* Chris Morrison, U.K. Government Pours Big Sums into Latest UN Crackdown on Climate Dissent, dailysceptic.org, December ??, 2024:
It is far too early to call the death of Net Zero. Powerful interests to keep the show on the road are embedded throughout controlling elites. Emeritus Professor Richard Lindzen of Harvard and MIT has spent decades pondering how the fraud and corruption works. What historians will definitely wonder about in future centuries, states Lindzen, is how deeply flawed logic, obscured by shrewd and unrelenting propaganda, actually enabled a coalition of powerful special interests to convince nearly everyone in the world that CO2 from human industry was a dangerous, planet-destroying toxin. “It will be remembered as the greatest mass delusion in the history of the world – that CO2, the life of plants, was considered for a time to be a deadly poison,” he added.
At least one positive outcome of Green policies and mass third world immigration is that it will be a catalyst for a modern-day Holy Roman Empire, when Europe goes into a great depression — it will be the only way for the of cultural and physical survival of Europeans.
Sheesh! So you would actually consider Encyclopaedia Britannica as not being university quality, BP8? Or that Conservapedia (the project of the spawn of international joke Phyllis Schlafly) is equal in merits to Encyclopaedia Britannica? Or that since all have some degree of error it really does not matter which encyclopedia one consults? Come on! Conservapedia is blatant satire of the Christian conservative community! It's bottom feeding at its worst, kind of like the Plain Truth was in its heyday.
I would have imagined that you, or someone, might have cited China's usage of coal in its electrical power plants as being evidence of their abuses or ignorance. But, doing that trashes ultra-conservative energy policy (in which coal is pretended to be good).
Finally, you don't have to call something an authority when you are sharing information from it. That is automatically implied. I know that might seem like a difficult thing in a world where someone who has been extensively prophesying over multiple decades tells us he is not a prophet, while another who does not prophesy cries in his matzohs and Mogen David because nobody accepts him as a prophet, or follows him.
BB
When cheap innuendos don't work, just misquote. That's ok, pardons for everybody!
I wouldn't call articles written by David John Hill for The Plain Truth magazine 'in it's hey day' as 'bottom feeding'.
Thanks! I also pardon you for wasting my time. Ain't gonna happen in the future.
BB
Everything in the PT back in the day was pure shite! DJH was indeed one of my faves, but he wrote much more salient articles as he became deeply immersed in his recovery and resolved the cognitive dissonance which had exacerbated his addiction to alcohol.. I think he was just about to come 100% clean and blow the lid off the whole can of worms with the next chapter of his memoir when he met his untimely death. He'd already described the crapshoot by which the nations of Western Europe were identified with corresponding tribes of Israel. You know, the wild guesses that later became church doctrine, components of the Armstrong "hook"?
Al Portune Sr. had a lot to share in his memoir as well. I always admired him, even though he had some very harsh words for me at one point in my life. But then again, what do I know? I also admired Ellis LaRavia, and Joe Tkach Sr and Jr. There were occasionally some very real human beings badly misplaced within the organization. My feeling is that they could have done so much more for humanity had they not fallen for the scam!
BB
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