Living Church of God members still cannot do anything right. It's a constant struggle to measure up to the standards LCG expects of them, and of which not one single leader in the Living Church of God has ever done himself. Not a single one!
Living Church of God members spend weeks before the Passover beating themselves up for one sin after another. Others wait till they walk in the door that night. Either way, walking into the room, you know ahead of time, that you are worthless and lower than the worms in the ground. Then as you are sitting there listening to the same story, every year, that you are worthless crap, you get to hear the breaking of the matzos as it is amplified through the sound system so that you feel EXTRA guilty as you recrucify Jesus Christ every year.
As Bereans Did had this up on their site today: Passover in the Age of Social Distancing
It's more challenging to clearly define the views of the Churches of God, since they never had a systematic theology and each splinter has its own flavor. Generally, though, the COGs view Passover – their annual communion service – as an observance critical to salvation. This view is based on Numbers 9:13:
But if anyone who is ceremonially clean and not on a journey fails to celebrate the Passover, they must be cut off from their people for not presenting the Lord's offering at the appointed time. They will bear the consequences of their sin.
This application is in keeping with COG teachings on “ongoing justification” - that man is initially reconciled to God through Christ's sacrifice, but then is responsible for keeping his own slate clean – to varying extents – through a track record of repentance and spiritual growth. In short, if you're required to keep your library record up to date, the appointment for renewing your library card is critical. and the schedule for available renewals is pretty limited - in this case, one evening per year.
This is exactly what Doug Winnail is describing below:
Passover and Beyond: The Holy Days are a vital part of God’s plan for mankind of eventually becoming part of His family. In the Passover and Days of Unleavened Bread, we are given two incredible tools to help us grow and develop the mind and character of God (Philippians 2:5; 1 John 3:1–3). To grow in this direction, we need to take time during this period to carefully examine our own thoughts and actions (1 Corinthians 9:24–27; 2 Corinthians 10:3–5). We need to honestly and prayerfully study God’s word and ask Him to help us see what commandments we are breaking and what instructions we are not following as we should (1 Corinthians 11:26–32). We also need to focus on clearly seeing our own shortcomings and resist judging others for their problems (Matthew 7:1–5). Recognizing the problems that are hindering our own growth is a big step toward becoming more like God and our Elder Brother Jesus Christ. It is also tremendously encouraging to realize that we can be forgiven of our sins (John 3:16). Yet, there is more to the process—we also need to be overcomers (Revelation 2:26–27; 3:12, 21). To actually make progress in overcoming our sins, we need to spend some time during the Days of Unleavened Bread planning how we are going to replace certain thoughts and actions that are holding us back from growing to become more like our Father. We need to “ponder the path of [our] feet” (Proverbs 4:26–27) and identify what changes we need to make (more time to pray and study, how we can treat others better, etc.)—and then focus on doing those things. Make a list and begin to work on it in the days following the Passover and Days Unleavened Bread, so we can prepare to be more effective instruments in God’s hands.
Have a positive and profitable Sabbath and Holy Day Season,
Douglas S. WinnailNot a single thing mentioned about what that sacrifice they claim to be celebrating or any word about justification or sanctification. But then, Jesus is not that important in the LCG. The law still reigns supreme.
23 comments:
The symbols and rituals become more important than what they were designed to represent. This happens with the Passover and Unleavened Bread observances of the ACOGs and with the communion services of more traditional Christians. As Gary suggested in his remarks, the reality is found in JESUS CHRIST and WHAT HE DID FOR US! When these things are reduced to formulaic and required behaviors, they tend to lose all of their connection to the spiritual reality they were meant to portray. How many of the folks who recite the pledge of allegiance, stand during the performance of the Star Spangled Banner or set off fireworks on the 4th of July are familiar with the U.S. Constitution, actually vote or would be willing to participate in the armed forces of the United States? Symbols are nice, but they can become meaningless rather quickly!
The bar has always been rather unreasonable from my experience with members, ministers and myself.
Matthew 5:48 "Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect."
No challenge there. Whether it means perfect as in sinless or , as often argued, "mature", no can do and never met anyone who could. Ranks right up there with if you have the faith of a mustard seed, you can command a mountain to throw itself into the midst of the sea. Don't know anyone like that either. I only knew of those who thought or acted like they were like this and those that knew they weren't and felt guilty or inadequate about it all thinking they should or must be.
Luke 10:27 He answered, "You are to love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your strength, and with all your mind; and your neighbor as yourself.".
Nuther high bar. "ALL" is a big word and leaves no room for "as much as you can", "mostly" or "as best you understand it". "ALL" puts a lot of pressure on heart, soul, strength and mind. That's like saying "You MUST relax". The "MUST" puts a certain pressure on the concept and word "Relax" creating stress and tension and thus defeating the who point. Must and should are also loaded words for humans.
Fortunately Paul somewhat lets everyone off the hook. After all, he is the Apostle, called from the womb and had the truth that if you crossed him with yours, he'd curse you for following "another Gospel". Pretty intense guy and very devoted.
However: Paul provides genuine humans some relief from the the "You must relax" problem.
15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I DO NOT DO, but WHAT I HATE I DO. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature.[c] For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 19 For I do not do the good I want to do, but the evil I do not want to do—THIS I KEEP ON DOING. 20 Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
21 So I find this law at work: Although I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22 For in my inner being I delight in God’s law; 23 but I see another law at work in me, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within me. 24 What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body that is subject to death? 25 Thanks be to God, who delivers me through Jesus Christ our Lord!"
So then, I myself in my mind am a slave to God’s law, but in my sinful nature[d] a slave to the law of sin."
Now, Paul tells the truth of being human here, even and Apostle human. He pulls up short on spelling out exactly what it was that he did that he didn't want to do and not doing what he knows he should. That would have helped. Much speculation as to his problems but he did not share that part of the struggle. I would have helped and we might like him more as it all would have sounded very familiar and provided us with a nice sigh of relief.
con't
con't
Paul struggled with the inability to become perfect and love with all this and that, first of all because he never knew he was to become that perfect, love with ALL his mind or be able with just a bit of faith to throw mountains into the sea. ALL that had been written after he lived, preached and died. As many can't accept. Paul never knew the Gospel Jesus character, never persecuted him in the Gospels, written after he died which is why he never quotes Jesus. He had no quotes in mind. He was on his own.
Thus we see he took extreme measures to measure up as he saw it.
I Cor 9:24-27
24 Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one gets the prize? Run in such a way as to get the prize. 25 Everyone who competes in the games goes into strict training. They do it to get a crown that will not last, but we do it to get a crown that will last forever. 26 Therefore I do not run like someone running aimlessly; I do not fight like a boxer beating the air. 27 No, I strike a blow to my body and make it my slave so that after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified for the prize."
Paul literally beat himself. Not figuratively, not spiritually, not mentally. Physically. This was to keep himself in line and not be "disqualified" for the prize. Paul had a bit of the problem as many do today with qualifying and disqualifying even though he wrote about the solution to it all. He had nervous tension over whether he was good enough it seems. Sound familiar?
No trying to become perfect here or love with all this or that. No amazing faith and big mountains. Just trying to bring himself up to code. This way of being, of course, informed his ultimate conclusion.
" 25 Thanks be to God, who delivers me through Jesus Christ our Lord!
So then, I myself in my mind am a slave to God’s law, but in my sinful nature[d] a slave to the law of sin."
In my experience with myself and others of all denominations, intents and beliefs, people don't change much over the course of their lives in the fundamental ways of personality and the results of their experiences. Of course many stop doing that which may kill them but the basic self is pretty much the same throughout.
Coming to drop the fear, guilt and shame in life as probably the most useless of emotions is the key. For better or worse, it is why we seek ritual, Christian or otherwise to ease the tensions the word "MUST" puts on the word and practice of "RELAX"
"All of us have become like one who is unclean,
and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags;
we all shrivel up like a leaf,
and like the wind our sins sweep us away." — Isaiah 64:6
Certainly repenting, and submitting to the leadership of Christ in our lives is important, but in the end, we cant feel too
smug about our own righteousness. It falls way short, as scripture plainly tells us.
"As The Bereans Did" is about as theologically sound as the Roman Catholic Church.....why not quote the pope to try to discredit the actions of those that follow Christ?
Hey Gary check out this site:
https://wmscog.com/christ-ahnsahnghong/
The crazies are all over.
km
Dennis:
Once again, as a believer, I must take exception.
"ALL that had been written after he lived, preached and died. As many can't accept."
I fully accept that scholars have uncorroborated beliefs about when the gospels were authored. I fully accept that you insist that the uncorroborated dates must be accepted as proven no matter how contrary this is to your vaunted appreciation for Scientific Method. Nobody else believes they are proven. If it turns out that the "finished" gospels were circulated after Paul, it tells us nothing about what early Christian writings Paul may have read or heard in his lifetime. I also believe that Paul had direct contact with Jesus as Paul relates. He was not "on his own." How much of what Paul wrote may be direct quotation of Christ is, therefore, indeterminable. Paul writes of perfection in his epistles. The Greek words translated for perfection need to be carefully considered because they do not always imply a final perfective state.
While my view does not wholly and decisively invalidate your view, and my view contains its own assumptions, it has just as much validity as yours. So there is no foundation for you looking "down your nose" at believers that you like to regard as pathetically uneducated and deluded. What Ambassador College taught you about yourself may not be true.
Anonymous 4/9 @ 7:13,
Those who would truly follow Christ would do well to heed these words:
"We need to avoid the spiritual sickness of a church that is wrapped up in its own world: when a church becomes like this, it grows sick." -- Pope Francis
see https://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/pope_francis_507788
Comment was made saying: "...This application is in keeping with COG teachings on “ongoing justification” - that man is initially reconciled to God through Christ's sacrifice, but then is responsible for keeping his own slate clean – to varying extents – through a track record of repentance and spiritual growth...This is exactly what Doug Winnail is describing..."
Doug Winnail, when it comes to discussing one's salvation, is so much into "fear religion" and works of SELF...still striving to earn something impossible to earn.
What's new? None of Doug Winnail's writings. Why not? That would require a repentance/change that he (join the club of the rest of us) is incapable of doing. You gave us the answer in another one of your comments where you wrote: "...In my experience with myself and others of all denominations, intents and beliefs, people don't change much over the course of their lives in the fundamental ways of personality and the results of their experiences. Of course many stop doing that which may kill them but the basic self is pretty much the same throughout..." That is so true.
Even the ancient physical Israelites would never have changed enough on their own to finally exodus out of the land of Egypt. God granted those people the necessary repentance/changes b/c He has "veys to make one cooperate" to do things His way for His purpose(s). They are all His witnesses, and will live again, and they will admit how evil it was living in bondage in Egypt and the miracles that occurred that enabled them to finally escape from Egypt. People were learning to hate evil. The Israelites have a lot of examples of that in their dealings with other nations that came after Egypt: e.g. Assyria, Chaldean-Babylonian empire, Persian empire, Greco-Macedonia, Rome....and still there is some "Gog" yet ahead some time in the future. Of course, time will tell.
Anyway, you concluded with commenting about Doug Winnail saying: "Not a single thing mentioned about what that sacrifice they claim to be celebrating or any word about justification or sanctification. But then, Jesus is not that important in the LCG. The law still reigns supreme."
Why? Doug does not understand how Col 2:13 "And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;" applies to members in the Living group if they had received God's Spirit.
Also, Doug does not understand how "...Christ our passover is sacrificed for us: [{is sacrificed: or, is slain}
In other words, what is with the annual beating, some huge Santa Claus bag of sins, observing some Passover service, and magically sins then again disappear for aother year...only to turn around and probably within 24 hours some way, somehow, sin again...begin to fill up the magical bag with sins for another year.
Doug's lack of understanding goes so far, that he (and probably most in the xcogroups) cannot preach the following verse:
"To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation." [{committed … : Gr. put in us } 2 Cor 5:19
In other words, God is not only in the business of repentance/change, but also into reconciling the world, but He is doing it His way, and not Doug's way.
But repentance for/to Doug will eventually come, but time will tell...
John
7:32.
A Korean based cult. Take a look at the video HERE
Any "looking down my nose at " that you insist must exist is an illusion on your part. That the Gospels were written long after Paul by anonymous authors originally is common belief and perspective in the world of higher biblical criticism.
Speaking of library cards, I think the British Israel believers are about to get another lesson as genetic science once again rears its head. Scientists have been mapping the genome of Covid 19, have discovered that there are at least 7 strains. The primary one or ones that are infecting US citizens didn't come from China. They are European in origin. Individuals can be infected by one or more strains, with the seriousness of the illness deepening in cases where there are multiple strains infecting.
Dennis at 9:41am, maybe so but that doesn't make them right.
Dennis:
At one time it was a common belief in the scientific community that the sun was the center of the Universe. "Common belief" does not fit anywhere in the Scientific Method model. Since you (and the higher critics) have no substantive proof, I can assert that Paul viewed pre-publication versions of the Gospels with equal validity. Your assertion is like nobody knew anything about Jesus and the Gospels until they were written up. This is both unproveable and improbable.
Whatever works for you NEO.
Mr. Diehl said:
Coming to drop the fear, guilt and shame in life as probably the most useless of emotions is the key. For better or worse, it is why we seek ritual, Christian or otherwise to ease the tensions the word "MUST" puts on the word and practice of "RELAX"
Sitting comfortably in my easy chair with a belly full of unleavened bread, I would say from my perspective that this is the exact recipe that the rogue leaders and ministers in the COGs are using to wreck havoc on the life of innocent and complying people who are committing their lives unto God through men who have no fear, no guilt and no shame.
These would be the three measures of meal that anyone with a conscience wouldn't dare add leaven to.
Anyhow, word on the street is that certain preachers are using that useless emotion of shame to derail the scientific validity of evolution.
What gets thrown in the garbage can by some people, is made into a weapon and used or turned into gold by others with an eye for value.
A personal Comment
I believe the bible should be read in a positive way as it applies to human life experiences. It should be seen as a good finder rather than a fault finder. I have read and studied the Christian Bible for as a guide line for my years I have attempted to live in harmony with Christian faith. My belief in the God of the Bible has never been shaken nor will it be due to over 88 years of life. The good, bad, and ugly of life was managed in a way that the Faith, Hope, and Love gave the death of my human body as a fulfillment of God’s purpose for my human existence.
When I read some of the things posted and commented here and elsewhere, I wonder what kind a person takes pleasure in promoting things that are corrupt and critical being use about bible and religion in the world today. It appears to me that truth used to destroy what believers may have in questionable religious organizations is more destructive than helpful to many readers.
April 9, 2020 at 12:15 PM
Your a true believer. That is your choice.
It is certain people who use the bible against you in order to extort money using fear.
W.
Miller:
I recall Ron Dart in a sermon stating that if you get into the form, you will get into the substance. And if you lose the form, you will lose the substance. He was speaking of he Sabbath and the idea that it was outwardly a form that pointed to a depth of meaning. When Israel quit keeping the Sabbath, Israel lost connection with God.
I disagree with Dart on this. I agree with what you and NO2HWA have written here. People seem to have a natural proclivity to prefer physical forms, ceremonies and trappings. In a competition, I believe the symbols will always dominate and the substance will lose out. I have felt many times that Armstrongists were preoccupied with ritual yet knew very little about Christ.
NEO, if we're thinking about the same Ron Dart sermon it used the Israel of Jeroboam and his successors to illustrate the certainty of your latter point (lose the form, lose the substance) much more than the possibility of your former (get the form, get the substance).
As far as the comparative value of form and substance he later said "What's required for all this [Isaiah 1:16-20] to happen? To wash yourself up. Clean up your life. Straighten up your act. Put away the evil of your doings from before his eyes. Stop doing evil. Learn to do well, seek judgment, relieve the oppressed, judge the fatherless, plead for the widow.
All these things are the substance of your religion. All these other things are the form of your religion. Frankly religion without form tends to lose its meaning. But one that has form and no substance is no religion at all. It seems like so much of the world has great difficulty understanding this. There are many people who give so much attention to form. They become totally absorbed in the form of their religion and methodology of their religion, and they'll argue with you about it til the cows come home. They can get involved in debates with you and be persuasive and studying Greek words and all these things about form.
Then there's another group of people who try their best to practice the substance of religion. They make very good neighbors and they're the kind of people I like driving down the road when I am broken down in my car, because they would stop and would take care of you or give you a lift. But they feel that that's all there is to it, that the care of their fellow man is enough. They turn around and absolutely ignore the worship of their God.
No, there should be form and substance in our religion. And I certainly feel that it may be much more tolerable in the day of judgment for the man who goes out and stops and takes care of his neighbor, who is a good Samaritan, than it is for the man who is a good Pharisee, and who has all the form right, but will not take care of the substance. If I had to take my chances with one or the other of them in the judgment, I would much rather be the good Samaritan. But I would rather be the person who worships God in the way God wanted to be worshiped, to follow the form of religion as God taught it so that I might learn more about God, so that I might draw closer to Him and understand Him and know what He's doing and have the concept of what His plan is about and also be the person who is a good Samaritan."
You wrote "I have felt many times that Armstrongists were preoccupied with ritual yet knew very little about Christ." Dart also said "It is very difficult to keep human beings from reverting to carnal ordinances as an escape. ... So many people that have a good firm grasp on the form of the worship of God think that they have a relationship with God, when in fact they have taken hold of the easiest part of Christianity. Why are you doing what you are doing? Because it is right? Or because it is easier than the alternative?"
NEO,
Ron Dart had one of the best understandings of the symbolism surrounding the Sabbath and Holy Days of any of the leadership within the ACOGs. Nevertheless, I think that he was engaged in a bit of wishful thinking in this instance. For most folks, as you say, the substance begins to fade and the form becomes all important. That doesn't mean that symbols and rituals are inherently bad, but it should make all of us more careful about their use. We don't want to turn into programmed automatons who mindlessly perform what others have inserted into our memories! The bread and the wine can be used to remind us of what our Lord and Savior did for us, or they can become a meaningless weekly/monthly/quarterly/yearly exercise in futility. And we must remember that salvation through Jesus Christ is essential, rituals are NOT.
Tonto
You left out the next verse of Isaiah 64.
Isaiah 64.7 "And there is non that called upon they name, that stirreth up himself to take hold of these: for thou hast hid thy face from us, and has consumed us because of our iniquities."
So the context isn't one of people putting out effort trying to do the right thing, but falling short. Both the parents of Christ and John the Baptist were blameless, something they had a right to be proud of. As usual, the envious killjoys respond with their usual "don't think you're better than me," projected into the Bible.
The responsible have a right to be proud of the character that they have built. Their distractors can go eat cake.
""We need to avoid the spiritual sickness of a church that is wrapped up in its own world: when a church becomes like this, it grows sick." -- Pope Francis"
the RCC in a nutshell
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